Muslim Minority in Thrace

[akritas]

Pomaks, along with Turks and Muslim Roma living in Thrace, are officially recognized as a religious Muslim minority, in accordance with the Treaty of Lausanne (1923) and formally enjoy the corresponding rights, though they have been treated as Turkish and not Pomak speakers by the authorities. So, there is no teaching of their language, despite the Treaty of Lausanne’s guarantee of education in the Muslims’ own language; this deficiency is admitted even by the official Hellenic authorities (COMS, 1994). Likewise, there is no teaching in Pomak, but it is sometimes used by teachers to explain some things orally to kindergarten and primary school pupils. If required, Pomak may be used in courts and interpreters will be provided, as this is guaranteed by the Treaty of Lausanne: nevertheless, Pomaks use Turkish in such occasions.

Assessing the number of Turks and Pomacs in Hellas is problematic. The census of 1928 recorded 191,254 Turks while the 1951 census recorded 179,895 Turks of whom virtually all were either Muslim by religion, 92,219, or Orthodox, 86,838. While some live on the Hellenic islands neighbouring Turkey, most live in Western Thrace. The Pomaks, Muslim Slavs, or a small number of Muslim Hellenics, tend to live also in Western Thrace in villages in the southern Rhodope and due to the official reticence to give figures for ethnic minorities, only for religious ones, it is hard to separate them from the Turks; however, the villages near the Bulgarian border in all three provinces of Western Thrace are predominantly Pomak with the exception of some like Mikron Dereion which have a mixed population of ethnic Turks, Pomaks and Hellenic Orthodox, or others which have a sedentary Muslim Gypsy population. Many Pomaks also live in Komotini and Xantini and some also live in Dhidhimotikhon.
Official Hellenic sources tend to claim that the Turks are Pomaks or Muslim Hellenics while, conversely the Turks claim the Pomaks as Turks. Estimates from the Information Office at the Hellenic Embassy in London based on the 1981 census figures give a total of 110,000 people belonging to religious minorities of whom some 60,000 are Turkish-speaking Muslims; 30,000 Pomaks; and 20,000 Athingani (descendants of Christian heretics expelled from Asia Minor during Byzantine rule) or Roma Gypsies. However, Turkish Muslim sources from Western Thrace claim a total of 100,000 to 120,000 Turkish-speaking Muslims in Western Thrace and most observers estimate between 100,000 and 120,000 Muslims out of a total population for Western Thrace of some 360,000 recorded in the census of 1971. Of the other minorities there are small populations of Gagauz, Christian Turkish-speaking people, for example around the city of Alexandroupolis, and Sarakatsani, Hellenic speaking transhumants, especially in the village of Palladion. Fieldwork by F. De Jong in 1979, to whom much of the above is indebted, notes that there are no longer any Circassians in Western Thrace.

Education

In the vital field of education the Hellenic authorities have steadily increased teaching in Hellenic at the expense of Turkish. From the 1960s onwards religious teachers from the Arab world have progressively been reduced while the employment of teachers from Turkey to Turkish schools in Western Thrace has been stopped. Since 1968 only graduates from a special academy in Thessaloniki [Selanik] can be qualified to teach in Turkish schools. This academy takes much of its intake from Greek secondary schools and, its critics claim, relies on an outdated religious curriculum deliberately to create an incompetent Hellenized education system in Western Thrace isolated from the mainstream of modern Turkish culture. The situation has deteriorated with the authorities introducing an entrance exam for the two Turkish secondary minority schools in Komotini and Xanthi - there are some 300 Turkish primary schools - and a directorate from the government in March 1984 stipulating that graduate examinations from Turkish secondary and high schools have to be in Hellenic.The implementation of this law in 1985 with, in some cases, merely a few months' notice was extremely hard on the unfortunate students. The result of these measures has been a dramatic decline in secondary school students in Turkish schools from 227 in Xanthi and 305 in Komotini in 1983-4, to 85 and 42, respectively, in 1986-7. Greek history books portray Turks in crude stereotypes and while Turkish pupils are allowed some books from Turkey, there have been inexplicable delays resulting in long outdated textbooks having to be used.
The authorities have also prohibited the use of the adjective "Turkish" in titles denoting associations etc. and the Turkish Teachers Association in Western Thrace was closed by order of Komotini court on 20 March 1986, a decision upheld by the Athens High Court on 28 July 1987.

POMAKS

Pomaks are those whose mother tongue is Pomakika (name in Greek -Πομάκοι)/ Pomakci (name in their language); most linguists call that language Pomak and, sometimes, Bulgarian. The Pomak language belongs to the linguistic family of the Southern Slavic languages, and, within them, to the linguistic group of Bulgaro-Macedonian. There is no information on Pomak dialects. Although there is no written tradition, the appropriate alphabet to write the language is the Cyrillic. It is generally believed that Pomak is one of the various Bulgaro-Macedonian dialects which existed in the Southern Balkans before the emergence of modern nation-states and their corresponding literary languages.
Pomaks live in the three departments of Western Thrace: they are the main component of the Muslim (in fact today Turkish) minority in Xanthi. There have not been any official statistics since 1951 (and the preceding statistical data are not very trustworthy). The best estimate for the Pomaks today is a figure around 30,000. The Greek state gives an estimate of 35,000 (COMS, 1994); so do authors ‘acceptable’ to the Greek state: Hidiroglou (1991:45) and Notaras (1994:47). The 30,000 estimate is based on a Hellenic Helsinki Monitor/Minority Rights Group-Greece detailed estimation, on the basis of the census data and the synthesis of the minority communities as provided by both the Greek authorities and local minority sources. It is also the estimate of Nakratzas (1988:131) and De Jong (1994). Seyppel (1989:42) gives an estimate of 20,000-30,000.
The historical origins of the Pomaks or Achrjani (as they also used to call themselves) are obscure (De Jong (1980:95); moreover, very little is known about their evolution, even as recently as in the XIX century. This ignorance therefore provides a fertile ground for another controversy in the Balkans. As Bulgarians, Hellenics and Turks all claim that Pomaks are a component of their respective nations or simply want to assimilate them (Sarides, 1987), they provide different ‘national histories’ (or perhaps ‘national fictions’) which usually ‘devaluate or ignore “disturbing” facts’ (Seyppel, 1989:43 & 48).
Authors consider Pomaks to be the descendants of ancient Thracian tribes which were in turn Hellenized, Latinized, Slavized, Christianized and finally Islamized. Those of them who stayed in the mountains succeeded in remaining ‘pure’ descendants of these ancient tribes and they have many Hellenic, if not Homeric, words in their vocabulary. Greeks even use anthropometric and ‘blood-group’ research to prove that Pomaks are very different from Turks and are similar to Greeks (Seyppel, 1989:42; Sarides, 1987 and references therein; Hidiroglou, 1991 and references therein). For Hellenics, Pomak is a derivative of the Ancient Greek word ‘Pomax’ (‘drinker’) which reflects the Thracians’ known habit of drinking; and Achrjani is a derivative of the ancient Thracian tribe of ‘Agrianoi’ (Seyppel, 1989:48).

[akritas]

Current situation of the minority and the language


Through the end of 1995, most Pomaks lived in a military “restricted zone”, access to which required a special permission, hardly ever granted to foreigners and therefore to foreign scholars (Seyppel, 1989:44). The zone was abolished in November 1995. The inhabitants of the villages within the zone have had special identity cards which restrict their freedom of movement within the limits of the department (within 30 km from their village through 1992): to travel or resettle further away, they too need a permit from the authorities, although this provision appears not to be strictly enforced (Dimitras, 1991:78; & 1994:21-2). These special measures were not abolished in November 1995.

Pomaks identify themselves with the Turks and, in the presence of outsiders, would even change the language of communication among themselves from Pomak into Turkish (Seyppel, 1989:47; Frangopoulos, 1990:90; Dimitras, 1991:77). Most Pomaks have today a double identity: an ethnic Pomak and a national Turkish one (see Dede, 1994:13). This assimilation into the Turkish nation was certainly helped by the Hellenic state’s decision, in 1951, to introduce Turkish-language education for Pomaks in an effort to distance them from Bulgarians. But, it is believed that the main reason for the Muslim minority’s homogenization has been the Pomaks’ feeling that through their identification with Turks they would no longer be a minority into a minority, or have no one to defend their rights.

Some Pomaks go as far as denying the existence of an ethnic Pomak identity, deny the existence of a separate ethnic identity besides their Hellenic national identity. Moreover, they hear with incredulity that their language can be written, believing that such efforts are aiming at distancing them from Turks (Frangopoulos, 1988:4).

So, there is no distinct Pomak leadership today: the community’s leaders form part of the Turkish minority leadership and defend Pomak interests as Turkish interests (Sarides, 1987). Pomaks, Turks and Muslim Roma in Thrace face many problems of discrimination from Hellenic authorities and a growing hostility from Hellenic public opinion (Helsinki Watch, 1990; Dimitras, 1991 & 1994). The persistent refusal of Hellenic authorities to respond to the minority’s demands led to a radicalization of the minority’s attitude, reflected also in the emergence since 1985 of independent minority candidates who have been receiving the majority of Muslim votes. Pomaks are also resenting the new effort of Hellenic authorities, evident since 1994, to attempt to dissociate them from the Turks and to give -at least to the most cooperating among- them some privileges, like access to higher education institutions or to officer rank during their military service: when Pomak leaders protest and remind that they have a Turkish national or ethnic identity, they become the object of violent, often insulting, attacks by Hellenic media (like Kathimerini) and political leaders (like the Parliament’s Speaker Apostolos Kaklamanis).
In education, the Pomak language has never been included in the educational curricula of the modern Hellenic state, but it is used as a means of communication among pupils at schools and, at the kindergartenand elementary level, sometimes by teachers. Otherwise, Pomaks attend the same schools with Turks and Muslim Roma in Thrace. According to Hellenic authorities, in 1994, for the whole Muslim (indeed Turkish) community, there were 231 Muslim elementary schools with 8,591 pupils and two minority secondary schools plus two Muslim seminars with 511 students: the secondary schools are obviously insufficient for the needs of the community, which is thus discouraged to send the children beyond primary school, although, according to Hellenic law, education is mandatory through the third year of secondary school. Many Pomak families, just like many Turkish families, therefore choose to send their children to schools in Turkey. Moreover, there is hardly any use of the language towards the authorities and in public services: in theory, Pomaks are allowed to address them in their language, through interpreters, but, as most speak Hellenic, they hardly ever opt to do it.

Today, most Pomaks are fluent in Turkish (the language of their education and the dominant language within the broad Muslim community), understand some Arabic (the language of the Koran) and can also speak Hellenic (a language they use to communicate with Hellenic s and Hellenic authorities). In the mountain villages, most speak Pomak at home; their language does not seem to be severely threatened with extinction and its use is not systematically discouraged by Greek authorities; nevertheless, as Pomaks identify with Turks, there is a tendency among the latter to discourage the use of Pomak, so as to achieve a better homogenization (i.e. Turkification) of the Muslim minority. Moreover, it appears that there is a slow decline in the use of the language among younger generations (De Jong, 1994).

Finally, although Pomaks live on the other side of the Hellenic-Bulgarian frontier too, there are very few transfrontier contacts: in fact, since the beginning of the Cold War, border crossings to Bulgaria have been closed in the two departments with significant Pomak populations (Xanthi and Rodopi), as Hellenic authorities wanted to avoid Bulgarian infiltration of the Pomaks of Hellas . In late 1995, Hellas and Bulgaria agreed to reopen these crossings. Their closing was one reason why most Pomak villages had since then been included in restricted military zones, with special permits been required to enter in or leave from these zones, even through 1994.

[Ptolemy]

Introduction

After the end of World War I, the victorious Allied Powers signed separate peace Treaties with each of the Central Powers and their allies. In the case of Turkey, and in light of subsequent developments that had rendered the Treaty of Sevres of 1920 out of date, the Treaty of Lausanne was signed on the 24th of July 1923.

The Treaty of Lausanne fixed the terms on which peace was reestablished with Turkey. It incorporated in its text the agreements signed between that country and Greece in January of that same year, which were part of the solution to the "Eastern Question."

One of these agreements was a Convention foreseeing the compulsory exchange of populations between the two countries. However, the Greeks of Istanbul, Imvros and Tenedos on one hand, and the Muslims of Thrace on the other, were exempted from this provision. The status of the minorities that, consequently, remained in the two countries, was based on two principles:


The principle of reciprocity: According to the provisions of articles 37-45 of the Lausanne Treaty, Turkey is bound to respect the freedom of religion and the right to the use of their own language for both Greek citizens established in Istanbul and Turkish citizens belonging to the Greek Orthodox faith. In exchange, Greece is obligated to respect the same rights and freedoms for those Muslim Greek citizens of Thrace who are of Turkish, Pomak, and Roma origin.
The principle of numerical balance between the populations that were excluded from the exchange. In Lausanne, the Turkish side, citing to the fact that in 1922 there were 270,000 Greeks living in Istanbul while the Muslims in Thrace did not exceed 86,000, requested the decrease of the Greek population that was to remain in Turkey so that a balance could be established between the minority populations of the two sides.
The constituent parts of the minority

In 1922, the Muslim minority of Greek Thrace numbered 86,000 people. Today, that number has climbed to approximately 120,000.

The minority is composed of three ethnic groups, from which the element of homogeneity is absent. More specifically, 50 percent of the minority is of Turkish origin, 35 percent are Pomaks (an indigenous population that initially lost its native tongue and subsequently espoused Islam during the Ottoman occupation), and 15 percent are Roma. Each of the aforementioned groups has its own language and traditions. It was for this reason that the drafters of the Treaty of Lausanne, aware of the diverse ethnic composition of the minority, characterized it as a "religious" minority.

The present situation

a. Strict compliance with international standards
The Greek State, mindful of the evolution of international standards regarding the treatment of minorities as reflected in a series of contemporary international documents (e.g., the CSCE documents on the Human Dimension) committed itself to the strict and unwavering application of the principles of equality before the law ("isonomia") and equality of civil rights ("isopolitia") for all the Greek citizens of Thrace. This was done without disregarding existing provisions and advantages regarding the special status of the Muslim minority of Thrace. These provisions were revolutionary for their time and are still considered perhaps unique in Europe even after the implementation of recent Conventions governing the status of minorities.

b. Economic reforms
Thrace, like other mountainous areas of Greece, was considered for a long period of time problematic from an economic and cultural point of view. This condition had negative consequences for both its Christian and Muslim citizens, albeit without any special or otherwise discriminatory practices weighing on the latter.

Furthermore, during the period of economic depression the number of Christians who emigrated to other countries for economic reasons was much greater than the number of Muslims.

In 1991, the Greek State, aware of the problems facing the region, put forth an important Development Plan. The plan aimed at the economic revitalization of Thrace and at improving the living conditions for the entire population of the area.

Following the recent changes in Central and Eastern Europe, the opportunities for the economic development of Thrace have been multiplied. Greek Thrace is the nearest region of the European Union to countries such as Bulgaria, Turkey, Romania, the Ukraine, and others. All these countries wish to achieve close political and economic co-operation with the Union. For this reason, a great number of enterprises from various countries have been established already in Thrace, aiming to take advantage of its unique and advantageous geographical position.

Advantages include, among others:

the already established road axes West to East (Egnatia road), North to South (Kiev-Bucurest-Ormenio-Alexandroupolis) and the new border crossings with Bulgaria,
the project to construct a pipeline that will carry the oil from the Kaspia region to Europe via Burgas (Bulgaria) and Alexandroupolis (Greece), and
the economic assistance provided to Thrace by the E.U. through resources of the 2nd Community Support Framework.
The above projects will clearly have positive results for the economic situation of the entire population of Thrace.
c. Religious freedom
This fundamental freedom is guaranteed for all Greek citizens by article 13 of the Greek Constitution.

In relevant part, Article 13 states that "Freedom of religious faith is inviolable." It further guarantees that "the enjoyment of personal and political rights does not depend on a person's religious beliefs."

With respect to Greek Muslim citizens, in each of the three Prefectures of Thrace there is a "Mufti," who is the supreme Muslim authority in his area of jurisdiction regarding religious and spiritual matters. The Mufti also has administrative jurisdiction over the lower Islamic functionaries.

The Mufti of each Prefecture is appointed following his selection by a body of prominent members of the minority, from a list of candidates who must be graduates of an Islamic Theological University.

It must be pointed out that the Mufti, in addition to his religious duties, also exercises judicial powers in matters of Civil Law, mainly in the fields of marriage, divorce, alimony, guardianship, emancipation of minors, testaments drawn up according to Islamic Law, and intestate inheritance. The decisions of the Mufti are recorded in the competent Registry Office according to the matter in question.

Law No. 1920, dated February 4, 1991, establishes that the decisions of the Mufti are not enforceable nor do they constitute a final judgment if they are not declared enforceable by the competent Court of the First Instance. Court review is limited exclusively to determining whether the Mufti, in judging the case, remained within his field of competence. The jurisdiction of the Court of First Instance does not extend to the interpretation of the Holy Islamic Law nor to an assessment of the actual facts of the case.

Finally, the Greek Civil Code provides Muslim women with the right to choose between Islamic and Common Law. This provision compensates for the fact that the resolution of disputes in accordance with the Sharya, the Sacred Islamic Law, sometimes entails, especially for Muslim women, the application of rules that are more onerous than those of the Common Law for other Greek citizens.

d. The untrammeled teaching of the rules of Islam
Two Theological Schools (Coranic Schools) with five grades of classes exist in the towns of Komotini and Echinos. The schools were founded in 1949 and 1956, respectively. They ensure the religious education of those Muslim children who aim either at continuing their studies in religious educational institutions of a higher level or at exercising the functions of a Hatip or an Imam; i.e. becoming a lower-level religious functionary of Islam.

[Ptolemy]

e. The instruction of the minority language
Articles 40, 41, and 45 of the Treaty of Lausanne guarantee the right of education for the Muslim minority in Greece, subject to the principle of reciprocity with Turkey.

Turkish is the only minority language which exists in written form (Pomak and Roma do not). It is taught in over 240 minority schools (primary and secondary schools and lycees) in Thrace, to a total of 10,500 Muslim students.

The education of these children is the responsibility of a large number of teachers (770), of which more than 250 are graduates of the Special Teachers' Training College in Thessaloniki, founded in 1971 to educate and train teachers for minority schools.

As teaching takes place mainly in the minority language, a large number of minority students end up acquiring an imperfect knowledge of Greek. For many, this situation constitutes a very serious obstacle to their social and professional integration into the larger Greek society, and restricts their economic, social or geographical mobility.

In order to remove this obstacle, an ambitious reform of the educational system has been undertaken, aiming at improving the means by which Greek is taught at minority schools. At the same time, the Ministry of Education has proceeded to the drafting and publication of a series of new school text-books in the Turkish language so that the minority's sole written language might be fully taught with the aid of contemporary texts. These textbooks, while addressed to Greek citizens, aim at fully respecting the unique and rich religious, linguistic, and cultural particularities of the minority.

f. Upgrading the standards of education
The Greek government, in its effort to follow and even exceed contemporary standards, put into force in October 1995 a new law regulating matters pertaining to the education of the minority in Thrace. The law aims at upgrading the quality of the education afforded Muslim Greek citizens and at facilitating their educational advancement.

In order to increase the quality and continuity of teaching in minority schools, the law requires that high teacher qualifications -- including teacher training, graduate studies, foreign language skills, and familiarity with other cultures, civilizations, and religious practices -- be taken into account during the appointment of teachers to minority schools.

The law also introduces English language courses at the primary school level.
Furthermore, the law establishes special financial and retirement incentives for teachers who choose to teach at minority schools.

Finally, the law establishes an affirmative action ("positive discrimination") program for the admission of Muslim minority students to Greek higher education institutions (universities and technical institutes). The law provides for a minimum quota for minority students, as had been up to now the case for certain other classes of Greek citizens (e.g., children of emigrants and repatriates). The provision aims at offsetting the disadvantages faced by many Muslim students during the national university entrance examinations, due mostly to Greek language difficulties, and at facilitating their integration into the social fabric of the country. It goes without saying that the above provisions do not prevent Muslim students from participating in the nation-wide University admission examinations.

In a different vain, it must also be noted that the Greek State provides substantial financial support for the covering of the operational expenses of minority schools. In 1994-95 approximately one-half billion drachmas (approx. 1.7 million ECU) were provided for maintenance of existing minority school infrastructure. New primary and secondary schools are presently being constructed at a total cost of 2 billion drachmas (approx. 6.7 million ECU).

g. Media
More than 10 turkish-language newspapers are published in Thrace. Furthermore, the National Radio Service transmits daily news bulletins and other informative programs in Turkish. It goes without saying that the reception of all radio and television programs of neighboring Turkey is unobstructed, while there is a large number of private radio stations that transmit exclusively in Turkish.

Participation of the minority in Greek politics

a. Parliamentary elections.
The Muslims of Thrace participate actively in Greek political life and a good number of them are members of political parties. During Parliamentary elections all political parties include, on a permanent basis in their electoral lists, Muslim candidates. In almost all the successive Parliaments from 1927 onwards, the Muslim deputies (usually 2) were elected and participated actively in parliamentary work.

Today's Parliament, which resulted from the elections of October 1993 does not include Muslim deputies. This is due to the fact that, beginning in the late 1980s, some members of the minority choose stand for election as independent candidates. The resulting split in the minority vote due to multiple minority candidacies and trends within the electoral body prevented the election of Muslim members of Parliament in 1993. Clearly, if this combination of factors does not recur in the next Parliamentary election, the Greek Parliament is quite likely to include Muslim deputies once again.

b. Regional and Municipal elections
During the elections of October 1994 for the regional councils (second level of local government), 12 Muslim prefecture Councilors were elected in the Prefectures of Xanthi and Rhodopi. Among them was the deputy Prefect of Rhodopi.

It should be noted that in the cities and villages of Thrace where the Muslim element is in the majority, a Muslim mayor is usually elected. In the communities where there is a Christian majority, it is quite common to have a considerable number of Muslims being elected as Municipal Councilors

http://www.hri.org/news/greek/misc/96-04-06.mgr.html

[akritas]

This is a web site from the Turks in Greek Thrace

http://www.trakyaninsesi.com/

We need to give our attentions also on them

[Ionian Sword]

The Pomaks are of pure Greek national ethnical identity and its reall a shame and a tragedy that the treacherous Greek governments the last 50 years did what ever they could to persuade them to create a turkish national identity.

[Titus]

This issue is επίκαιρο now. Background information: as everyone is likely aware, there is a significant ethnic minority in Greece. This minority is located in Thrace (Θράκη) and is 30% of the population in that region according to the Greek government. The Turkish government however raises this figure to 35%, but basically agrees that Greeks are the majority. The effect of this is that Thrace cannot become a Kosovo, a western FYROM or a Bosnia.

This minority is officially recognized as the "Muslim minority" because this is what the Treaty of Lausanne calls it. However, this minority is for all purposes an ethnic Turkish minority (even though only 50% have the Turkish language as their mother tongue). The reason for this is that they all tell people that they are Turks and look to Ankara for support and accept any instructions from Ankara through the Turkish consulate which is conveniently located in Komotini. In the special minority schools, where the Turkish language is used along with Greek, the Turkish government always has a say in what goes in the schoolbooks, so I think it's safe to say that Turkey has a significant influence in the region.

Our "good" "friends", the Helsinki Monitor, Human Rights Watch etc say that the Greek government is violating human rights by not recognizing this minority as a Turkish ethnic minority but only as a Muslim religious one. Members of the minority itself say that they want to be recognized as a Turkish ethnic minority so this case is different to the Slavophones of Macedonia most of whom (i.e. everyone except Rainbow Party) say that they are Greeks and don't want to be recognized as an ethnic minority.

Thus the question: should the minority in Thrace be recognized as a Turkish ethnic minority (which is what it really is) or should it remain officially a Muslim minority (which is what it legally is)? Greece is under no obligation to recognize them as Turks (because the Lausanne Treaty calls them Muslims), so if Greece did so, it would be to show that they are doing more than they have to out of respect and tolerance (blah blah ). Perhaps Greece could link the status of the minority with that of the Greek minority in Turkey: for example the Greek government could say to the Turkish government "we'll recognize the minority in Thrace as a Turkish minority if you reopen the Halki Theologican Seminary and freely allow Greek clergy (priests) without Turkish citizenship to access the Ecumenical Patriarchate and its emanations, just like Israel does (or did) with the Patriarchate of Jerusalem and Egypt with the Patriarchate of Alexandria".

[Flipper]

Originally Posted by Ionian Sword

The Pomaks are of pure Greek national ethnical identity and its reall a shame and a tragedy that the treacherous Greek governments the last 50 years did what ever they could to persuade them to create a turkish national identity.

They are not originally Greeks but they don't like when you call them anything else. It is a shame they are not protected and they fall in the Turk category. It is an insult to call them Turks just because of their religion. I've lived in Thrace for six months and believe me, those people should get more attention.

[Titus]

Originally Posted by Flipper

They are not originally Greeks but they don't like when you call them anything else. It is a shame they are not protected and they fall in the Turk category. It is an insult to call them Turks just because of their religion. I've lived in Thrace for six months and believe me, those people should get more attention.

They should, however most of them don't want it (according to the Helsinki Monitor's report most consider it an attempt of "divide and rule"). Consider it like the Vlachs in Albania. Most Greeks consider the Vlachs of Albania as Greeks because that's what those Vlachs themselves say. Albanians however insist that they are separate. That's what Greece would be doing with the Pomaks if they tried to separate them from the Turks.

I think it would be wise to introduce the Pomak language into the minority schools though (whether as a compulsory or an optional lesson). After all, that's where the future leadership of the community will be coming from and they should know all the main languages of the minority not just Turkish.

[Reaper]

So after all this, roughly what percent would you say is pomak and what percent ethnic turk out of all the muslims in northern Greece.