Fyrom Won't Budge on Name

[GreekSlav]

Originally Posted by Draco

The Bulgarian dialects of FYROM.

To everyone else: Please Do Not Feed The Trolls.

I was simply asking a question, but your comment was the trolling one. A little funny, too.

[GreekSlav]

Originally Posted by Morphesau

From network54 along with a thousand.

Greek Slav (Login GreekSlav)
Makedonija Forum Mods Group

Actually it is much better to call Darius' army - Greek army, since 50,000 Greeks were fighting on Darius' side against Alexander and his Macedonians, while only 7,000 Greeks served as ‘hostages’ the ambitions of the Macedonian king (Green). These hostages, Alexander got rid of only when he learned that the Macedonian occupation troops have a firm control of the whole of Greece, when Antipater finally subdued the Spartans next to the rest of the Greeks. Here are the overwhelming proofs that the Alexander’s army was not a Greek army, and that Alexander did not care about the Greeks, but his Macedonians:

1. "This was the Panhellenic crusade preached by Isocrates, and as such the king’s propaganda section continued - for the time being - to present it. No one, so far as we know, was tactless enough to ask the obvious question: if this was a Panhellenic crusade, where were the Greek troops? Peter Green Alexander of Macedon [p. 157]

2. "The truth of the matter seems to have been that Alexander distrusted his Greek allies so profoundly - and with good reason - that he preferred to risk the collapse of his campaign in a spate of rebellion rather than entrust its safety to a Greek fleet." [p.192]

3. "The burning of Persepolis had written finish to the Hellenic crusade as such, and he used this excuse to pay off all his league’s troops, Parmenio’s Thessalians included. The crisis in Greece was over: he no longer needed these potential trouble makers as hostages." [p. 322]

4. "Of the sixty-five or so men named as hetairoi, 9 are Greek, including 3 mainlanders. Of the nine, four owed their position to life-long connections with Macedon: Nearchus and the brothers Erygius and Laomedon ere in fact raised as Macedonians, and Demaratus of Corinth had been associated with the court since the time of Philip II."

Note: Very small number of Greeks were hetairoi, next to the overwhelming number of Macedonians]

Conclusion:

Alexander's conquest was for the greatness of Macedonia. The Greeks served Alexander only as mercenaries and were assigned low garrison duties after 330. The 7,000 Greek 'hostages' that Alexander took with himself, were commanded by Macedonian officers, and had insignificant role in the Macedonian victorious battles. Therefore, Alexander’s conquest was a Macedonian conquest, not Greek, his empire can only be Macedonian (as it was), not Greek, an empire that was won by the Macedonians, not Greek.


=============================

That is another discussion and has nothing to do with the claim that Alexander was Slavic. He is not and the Slav Macedonians have no connection to him. I have always believe this. What you post here is misleading and quite surprising, coming from what I thought was an intelligent individual. Is this a move on your part because you could not think of any other response. I wonder, would I have been banned for doing what you have done. Never show your weaknessess as you have done here. People would take advantage of it.

You must have lots of time on your hands to look for posts on another forum and bring it here. Do you work or are you doing this at work?

[Morphesau]

Further more this parrot who CLAIMED never to support their ultra garbage writes;

In fact this is nothing more than their conviction which for years now has been handed out to young people in Greek schools from their earliest years and, most recently, has been propagated throughout the entire world. The thesis of the "Greek identity of Macedonia" is not scientifically supportable. We shall concentrate here on the earliest period.

In Greek scholarship, in numerous articles and books, the historical facts which go against the thesis of a "Greek Macedonia" are passed over. It is universally known that the classical Greek authors did not recognize the Macedonians as their fellow-countrymen, calling them barbarians, and they considered Macedonian domination in Greece as an alien rule, imported from outside by the members of other

Then another Greek defending us.

Istor the Macedonian
(Login istor)
Re: Ancient Macedonians and their language
No score for this post June 6 2005, 6:18 PM

Macedonians had always Greek names, toponyms, ways, heroes, gods, dialect and spread Greek Language and Civilization to the World. Macedonians named after Greek names ALLLLLLLLLLLLLLL the cities they built or renamed. Thus, Macedonians were always Greeks or a very strange people.

Istor
Macedonia, Greece

All here, saving the rest from deletions.
Makedonija / Macedonia Forum (State: R.M./Capital:Skopje)

Trying to save face from humiliation from being exposed as a lair. Off course what do you know of humiliation? I pity you.

[GreekSlav]

Originally Posted by Morphesau

Further more this parrot who CLAIMED never to support their ultra garbage writes;



Then another Greek defending us.


All here, saving the rest from deletions.
Makedonija / Macedonia Forum (State: R.M./Capital:Skopje)

Trying to save face from humiliation from being exposed as a lair. Off course what do you know of humiliation? I pity you.

No humiliation. It is another argument and has nothing to do with some fantasy connection between the Slav Macedonians and the ancient Macedonians. Mind you, I believe there was a limited amount of intermixing when the Slavs came south, but not enough for the ROMians and Macedonians of today to make claim on Alexander. Alexander was the greatest ancient Macedonian to spread Greek culture throughout his known world. He did not spread the Slavic culture.

Actually, the argument concerning Alexander being Greek or not is quite a fascinating one, don't you think. It tends to expand one's desire to know more about it. But what is positive is that he was never Slavic.

[Draco]

Wow, SkopSlav, I am impressed. I must congratulate you on the calibre of the sources from which you derive your information (in the form of copypasta). Congratulations Mr Scholarly Bigshot

To any viewers interested in behavioural patterns, notice how SkopSlav in the thread at network54 consistently avoids answering questions.

[GreekSlav]

Originally Posted by Draco

Wow, SkopSlav, I am impressed. I must congratulate you on the calibre of the sources from which you derive your information (in the form of copypasta). Congratulations Mr Scholarly Bigshot

To any viewers interested in behavioural patterns, notice how SkopSlav in the thread at network54 consistently avoids answering questions.

Why do you think that is so? What kind of responses to I get here from my answers? It is always the same everywhere, that Greeks that come across Greeks with views that does not conform to theirs, find it utterly unbelievable, and have only negativity toward that different Greek.

Also, I have answered many questions and even started a class on all the wonderful questions you all had. But I was banned from answering your questions. So tell me, why should I answer any more?

[Draco]

Originally Posted by GreekSlav

Why do you think that is so? What kind of responses to I get here from my answers? It is always the same everywhere, that Greeks that come across Greeks with views that does not conform to theirs, find it utterly unbelievable, and have only negativity toward that different Greek.

Also, I have answered many questions and even started a class on all the wonderful questions you all had. But I was banned from answering your questions. So tell me, why should I answer any more?

Darling, no one is stopping you answering questions (in fact, that people are asking you them means that they want them answered). When you were banned it was for trolling and insulting people (rationale). Morover, if you aren't going to answer questions, how can there be a healthy debate? Perhaps you should just leave the forum.

You try present yourself as a normal common sense person whereas all Greeks are delusional nationalists, however that image you try to set up for yourself cannot be taken seriously since you use Skopjian nationalistic sources but ignoring everything a Greek says as biased. Let's just face it, you're either a Skopjian diaspora nationalist or a diaspora Greek with a grudge against his motherland (yes, there are many people like this, most of the SYRIZA qualify).

[GreekSlav]

Originally Posted by Draco

Darling, no one is stopping you answering questions (in fact, that people are asking you them means that they want them answered). When you were banned it was for trolling and insulting people (rationale). Morover, if you aren't going to answer questions, how can there be a healthy debate? Perhaps you should just leave the forum.

You try present yourself as a normal common sense person whereas all Greeks are delusional nationalists, however that image you try to set up for yourself cannot be taken seriously since you use Skopjian nationalistic sources but ignoring everything a Greek says as biased. Let's just face it, you're either a Skopjian diaspora nationalist or a diaspora Greek with a grudge against his motherland (yes, there are many people like this, most of the SYRIZA qualify).

Trolling? If you look around, you will see many posts that are quite bad, directed at me, and they still remain. As far as I know, no one was banned due to those posts. I give back what is given to me, and I am the only one accused of trolling. Funny ways here.

[GreekSlav]

Originally Posted by Draco

Darling, no one is stopping you answering questions (in fact, that people are asking you them means that they want them answered). When you were banned it was for trolling and insulting people (rationale). Morover, if you aren't going to answer questions, how can there be a healthy debate? Perhaps you should just leave the forum.

You try present yourself as a normal common sense person whereas all Greeks are delusional nationalists, however that image you try to set up for yourself cannot be taken seriously since you use Skopjian nationalistic sources but ignoring everything a Greek says as biased. Let's just face it, you're either a Skopjian diaspora nationalist or a diaspora Greek with a grudge against his motherland (yes, there are many people like this, most of the SYRIZA qualify).

Not all Greeks, Draco. I have never said this. But it is true that some Greeks are delusional nationalists, like some Macedonians. If I had a grudge on Greeks or Greece itself, I would not travel so extensively to Greece and maintain an apartment there. I have views that does not conform to yours. But that does not mean I dislike Greeks or Greece in general. Matter-of-fact, I visit Greece more than any country, except for where I live. So please discontinue your attempt at trying to paint me as a Greek hater. I am sure about my Greekness, totally.

Syriza is just a bunch of communists. They are insignificant and mean nothing for most Greeks, except for those 5.5% that voted for them.

[Xiotis]

Originally Posted by GreekSlav

My statement has strength. It is paranoia and groundless. Why in the hell do so many Greeks listen to the bullsh.it that comes out of the mouths of fanatical Macedonians in ROM and elsewhere? Why? It is insignificant babble. It does not change anything. The history they claim as theirs do not magically get rewritten, where all of a sudden we open a book on ancient Greece, and all references to "Greek" has been replaced with "Macedonian". Nothing changes. Renaming their airport to the name of the greatest ancient Macedonian there ever was does not make him Slav and does not take him away from us. Come on, Greeks. Listening to the crap from those fanatics and getting emotional over what they name certain things just makes it seem as if we are all second guessing everything about being Greek. We are Greeks, we know our history, and we know who we are. We are positively sure of it. So why do a few fanatics move so many Greeks into giving life to their crap?

That is my view on all this. Let them make false claims. The world will never believe their claims on Greek history anyhow. Reacting to it is extremely counterproductive for Greece.

You still do not get the point. These sentiments are not confined to a lunatic fringe!

It is mainstream FYROMian thinking that asserts that they are the true representatives and heirs of the whole region they define as 'Macedonia'. Their government, cultural institutions, 'human rights' organizations, and diaspora organizations are all in on the act of promoting an unsupported history that bolsters this position.

Look at the crap posted on official government websites. In this GOVERNMENT website you can see how they try and associate modern FYROM with ancient Macedonia by talking about a mythical mixing of slavs with ancient Macedonians and how centuries later the Greeks 'dismembered' Macedonia with the implication that 'Macedonia' had existed as a static ethno/political entity populated by 'Macedonians' since ancient times.


CLICK>>Republic of Macedonia, Ministry of foreign affairs <<CLICK

You might be a liberal minded flower child but I do not want a new Greek generation dealing with a country called 'Macedonia' 25-30 years from now that is full of yahoos who have been led to believe that they are the true representatives and heirs of the whole region they define as 'Macedonia'. This systematic brainwashing and nation building has been taking place since the Yugoslav communist era.

The difference between you and me is that you think that these sentiments are confined to an extreme nationalist fringe while I think that these sentiments are wide spread and form a consensus because these views are being pushed and facilitated by a broad spectrum of FYROM institutions both home and abroad.

Do you want me to start posting more evidence to show that these sentiments are not confined to a lunatic fringe?