Albanian language

[Ervald]

Originally Posted by HellenicPride

What makes people with my opinions wrong? None of you have the right to judge my opinions on those people that we speak of and that is a damn fact. It has nothing to do with nationalism, fascism, communism or anything like that its a damn opinion plain and simple. I dont like them never did Bulgars, Albos, Turks and Skopjians. Why all because of history and present situations plain and simple.

My opinion on Albanians not being Illyrians is my opinion. It has never been proven that they are or that they are not. So I stand strong on this. Until history proves otherwise I will not change my opinion.

To the Albo I guess you dont like it when someone says stuff like that huh? Just imagine how I feel when I visit an Albanians site and all they do is make these wild claims on Greek history, lands and call it your own.

Also to the Albo who claims that the Slavs took land from you. None of the land you live on is yours to begin with. What land belongs to you historically Im very curious?

nono as a normal person I will say that, those albanians you see on forums are from diaspora, albanians who are born in usa or have been there for many years.

Is that the way you learn about albanian?

[Theodosivs]

Also to the Albo who claims that the Slavs took land from you. None of the land you live on is yours to begin with. What land belongs to you historically Im very curious?

This makes no sense. Albs dont base such claims on your opinion...

[Hermes]

We can say what we want,we cant change anything in particular, just make sick our mind.
You want proves about Illy.-Alb. connection, right, but who wrote history and how were them in doing that?
All orthodoxs were called greeks( like the Arberesh in south Italy) and you run to prove all it as true.If u want to make Greece with what have been called ''greek'', ok go on, but that could be a bastard nation, bcz all that is no true, anyway is your question.
I wonder about you ''New Hellines'' proud of your antic ancestors, looking your present, your flag, and what you claim for.What's similar? How was the Hellenic mentality and how the orthodox is? How could this be normal, when the second killed with violence the first?
It has been a great Hellenic culture&influence and has been an orthodox too.No one can put it down. The problem is : what we are pretending.
To put out Balcans ''Caucasus Albs" or to put out the slaves(serbs,croates,bulgarians..etc)?????
As u make your claims , i make mines : Alb language has been spoken more than 4000 years before.It hasnt been any alb antic university to say that, but words and others let by historians and cultures prove it. There are most of the names of your Hellenic Godness explained just from albanian,Etrusc language, Egyptian Godness( Amon, Ra, Zat, Faraon,deltas, Maat, Sia, every one can be explained by albanian having present their atributes)in Bible u can find little stories with very good elements, may be Christ had spoke it too. Homer not speaking new greek, wrote how he knew, and many of his words are excatly albanian(after 2800years)many other changed others diapeared.
U may say those are just coincidense.Why so much? why no way to explain from other languages?
If it was true,and first christians knew it, what would be the duty of the Christianity(practical not teorical one)?We know some of what they did, we know too what Catholics made in the NEW WORD to spread the name of The Son Of The GOD and His lessons.Blood, hate,slavery, discrimination,destroying the culture what was written and all that was diferent from their barbary.

Even to u wasnt told by your churches, the Orthodox did the same to the HELLENIC IDENTITY & ''barbar-illyrian''. I wonder about ''YOU HELLINES'' to be proud of all that.I as an Alb in heart and mind cant forget Islam barbary and even Christian one.As u see my nickname is HERMES, not Muhamet or Christian-Jewish one. I would ofend my identity, my culture, my Ancestors .

That has been in history Christianity, not too diferent from Islam, but it had a ''civilizated'' Politic inside that made it worse in a sense.How could Hellines put the Cross in their Flag(1821-30~)?
can anyone of u say if there was a pure Hellenic identity there or just hate for invasors and Islam?Or may be those were hellenizated(''barbar'') popution that had nothing else in comon with Hellines?And than them claim all the past-antic history of that land.Why cant it be possible.
With Islam u made the best,THNX for it, but what about Hellenic identity? Identity is not whats written in history or paper, its in traditions , language and others.About traditions what do u have in common with Hellines,is there anything to do with the ass?(sory for saying that, but it can be a great prove)By the other, all yours is christianity.
If there were some ''greeks''(arvanites) albanised in 150-200 years from some ''ignorant barbars'', what can we say about (year)1453 years and more before and after of Greek Culture, Language, Bizantyne Empire?? they could greeked many populations, may be you too. I have the idea that when Latin Lords in 13th century called these ''albanised greeks'' in Greece they wrote that there were entire empty areas. Where went Hellines? Having present that Turks killed too many others than, others emigrated and so on, it get to be no one. Who are you? We know who serbs are,but for you its no problem , those all are orthodox.

[Ervald]

well said Hermes

[Tsontos]

You guys are just like turks, forgetting what kind of a role religion played for the whole region. Because of Ataturk they have become all secular and now beleive religion never played a major role in their history and are ashamed to see what a role it did. I dont even beleive in god yet I recognise what a huge role religion played in the whole region.

How could Hellines put the Cross in their Flag(1821-30~)?

How can albanians have the Byzantine flag as theri flag?

[Amarantos]

Originally Posted by Hermes

..........................Or may be those were hellenizated(''barbar'') popution that had nothing else in comon with Hellines?And than them claim all the past-antic history of that land.Why cant it be possible...................

quite amusing the whole post.
I held this part so as to invite you to a place called Tyrnavos in the region of Thessalia,where a nice feast takes place during carnival celebrations. People (greek christians maybe?) go around the city holding dicks in their hands.Who knows why?
Go check some ancient pottery if you want to see pictures of the event
For the rest....talk is cheep

[Hellas7]

Originally Posted by Hermes

All orthodoxs were called greeks( like the Arberesh in south Italy) and you run to prove all it as true.

By who?

And who has ever called the Arberesh in Italy Greeks?

If u want to make Greece with what have been called ''greek'', ok go on, but that could be a bastard nation, bcz all that is no true, anyway is your question.

This makes no sense.

I wonder about you ''New Hellines'' proud of your antic ancestors, looking your present, your flag, and what you claim for.What's similar? How was the Hellenic mentality and how the orthodox is? How could this be normal, when the second killed with violence the first?

The "antic" Greeks are the ones who accepted Christianity smart guy.

It has been a great Hellenic culture&influence and has been an orthodox too.No one can put it down. The problem is : what we are pretending.

Again, I cannot understand what you are saying.

But nevertheless, alot of Ancient Greek culture made it's way into Christian, traditions, myths, even in the bible (from Anicent Greek religion). There was a fusion to a certain extent.

To put out Balcans ''Caucasus Albs" or to put out the slaves(serbs,croates,bulgarians..etc)?????

what?

As u make your claims , i make mines : Alb language has been spoken more than 4000 years before.It hasnt been any alb antic university to say that, but words and others let by historians and cultures prove it. There are most of the names of your Hellenic Godness explained just from albanian,Etrusc language, Egyptian Godness( Amon, Ra, Zat, Faraon,deltas, Maat, Sia, every one can be explained by albanian having present their atributes)in Bible u can find little stories with very good elements, may be Christ had spoke it too. Homer not speaking new greek, wrote how he knew, and many of his words are excatly albanian(after 2800years)many other changed others diapeared.
U may say those are just coincidense.Why so much? why no way to explain from other languages?

What the hell are you even talking about?

Even to u wasnt told by your churches, the Orthodox did the same to the HELLENIC IDENTITY & ''barbar-illyrian''. I wonder about ''YOU HELLINES'' to be proud of all that.I as an Alb in heart and mind cant forget Islam barbary and even Christian one.As u see my nickname is HERMES, not Muhamet or Christian-Jewish one. I would ofend my identity, my culture, my Ancestors .

If you are talking about Christian supression of Ancient religion, yes Greeks know of that. Some Greeks accepted Christianity fast, some later. What difference does it make and what is your point?

Somehow Albanians are neither Muslim or Christian, and this is supposed to somehow be linked with an ancient people and not decades of communism? You makeing NO SENSE.

And my name is HELLAS, that is an ancient name. My cousins name is Pericles, another Alexandros, another Aristotelis, my friends name is Athena, another friend Fillipos.... should I go on or do you see how assbackwards this is?


And do you know how many Albanians have Christian names?

Panajot? Sotir? Gjergj? Kostandin? etc...


I wonder about Islamic names also....

How could Hellines put the Cross in their Flag(1821-30~)?
can anyone of u say if there was a pure Hellenic identity there or just hate for invasors and Islam?

How can Albanians use the Byzantine as their flag? (Christian)

Or may be those were hellenizated(''barbar'') popution that had nothing else in comon with Hellines?And than them claim all the past-antic history of that land.Why cant it be possible.

Because the language was consistently spoken, non-Greeks were assimilated, this means Greeks were in the majority, otherwise it would have been the other way around.

There has to be Greeks to Hellenize "barbars".

With Islam u made the best,THNX for it,

Huh?

but what about Hellenic identity? Identity is not whats written in history or paper, its in traditions , language and others.About traditions what do u have in common with Hellines,is there anything to do with the ass?(sory for saying that, but it can be a great prove)By the other, all yours is christianity.

Many traditions are the same, names (both people and cities etc...) Even within Christianity as I said, I don't have time to list on and on. Also what about the Greek language smart guy? Forgot that little fact? Don't you have eyes, isn't the obvious... obvious?

If there were some ''greeks''(arvanites) albanised in 150-200 years from some ''ignorant barbars'' what can we say about (year)1453 years and more before and after of Greek Culture, Language, Bizantyne Empire?? they could greeked many populations, may be you too.

Many people were "greeked", but they had to be "greeked" by.... Greeks. Get the point?

And what are you supposed to be anyway, a direct descendent of some stupid Illyrians?

I have the idea that when Latin Lords in 13th century called these ''albanised greeks'' in Greece they wrote that there were entire empty areas. Where went Hellines? Having present that Turks killed too many others than, others emigrated and so on, it get to be no one. Who are you? We know who serbs are,but for you its no problem , those all are orthodox.

Then all you have to do is read a little more. Just because the Peloponnesos was depopulated, first of all does not mean all areas where Greeks were. Constantinople, Thessaloniki, all major cities, Asia Minor, the islands and many rural areas throughout the empire where populated by Greeks. Just because the areas Arvanites settled were depopulated does not mean it all was.

Just open a history book

[Flipper]

Re eimaste kala? Sto forum gia thn Epiro milame gia thn Albanikh glwssa? Afou xeretai pou pigainei auto...

[Hermes]

The eagle has been as a simbol more before Bizant.As u know Bizant(Kostandinopoli) was built by Kostandin the Great,and he was Illyrian, from Nissus, or do u want to make it greek too? Many others emprors were Illyrians too.I heard the Eagle has been as a simbol more than 9000 years ago, which population , i dont know, the autocton sure. Dont ask me about the source, i would only ofend myself if i would play lieing.If the source lies it would be a common problem than.

About religion, its true, it played a great role in the region, but it will be a shame for us( the young generation) not only what happened in the past, but what is happening now too.Islam and Christianity are not of European Identity, those are Asiatic fanatisem and worse. History shows it.
It wasnt my fault that my ancestors escaped from Arberia bcz of turk barbaria, even of my parents there, that under the genocide become muslim, bcz the
Patriakana of Istambul didnt protect them, and the Catholic one in Rome abandoned them bcz them took formal muslim names to escape discrimination, and they still wanted to be christian in everyday life.But 5 centuries were much.And today u can go in Albania, and see the churches and mosque,just few old persons and any withoutbrain of the society.This bcz even after 2000 years those are for people non-Albanian, non-Europian. Its not our identity there.As u said for the role , its realy true, and thats why albanians loosed too much, they had no christian aleats.Imagine yourself in 1821 without Rusia and others, may be it will be called still Greece, but would be not any Christian Greek there(u know about Armenians).

In italy all orthodox were and are called in general Greeks,no matter of nationality.Greek church(bcz the churches of the Arberesh have greek letters), Greek beautiness(for girls,see the film ''the godfather'', michael corleone in sicily)Greek people etc...but no one here felt that way.
If u see a map of Sicily before 50 years , near Palermo, u will find Piana dei Grecci,but after Greek state political presion on alb-identity they turned the name in the Piana dei Albanessi.(it was called of ''the greeks'' by the forigners(as albania too)and now bcz its a big problem to that way , that use ''of the albanians'')Also many Arberesh orthodox Nobils in mideval Italy are found sometimes in leters like ''X the greek'' their discedents today are very proud of being Alb-Arb, why would they lie if they were greeks.May be this is enough.

About the acception of the christianity by the antic greeks, u have to divide the Aristocracy and the simple People.The first had all interest about it, the last were cut in blood to accept it.It will be foolish too, that a culture like Hellines one would accept the Christian teory&filozofy.Those are so diferent.May be u dont know well those both.

Its true Ancient Greek Culture made its way into Christian one,refering what i said above , it would be a good way to be accepted.About Bible, its so dificult to explain, but as we know, jewish knew to do sth beter than other people.

[HellenicPride]

Thats what you get for letting Albanians come to a Greek forum. Then people wonder why I dont like Albanians. Isn't this enough?