Foreign newspapers of 19th/20th c. about Macedonia

[Victor]

Originally Posted by bonaqua

The term Macedonian is used as nationality.

No its not.

[BzNzSBoomN]

Bulgars decimated by French artillery near Florina

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstrac...q=florina&st=p

http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive...CF&oref=slogin

How come no Ethnic Makedonskis got decimated?

[kostas68]

One of the most usual Scopian claims is that they existed as separated nation and called themselves ethnic <Macedonians> from early 20th century,whereas at the same time the Greeks ignored the term Macedonia or they used it very rarely.Off course that's one more miserable lie of them,because they say only the half truth:They say that they called themselves <Macedonians> and that's only the half truth.What they forget to mention is the other half truth:They used the term <Macedonians> allways and exclusively regionally and geographically but when they wanted to declare their ethnicity,they always said clearly that they were Bulgarians.What happened and they became ethnic <Macedonians> is something that we all know.
As for the use of the terms <Macedonians> by Greeks,very interesting is the below article of N.Y. Times,from 1895:



GREECE WANTS INDEPEPENDDENCE
A Demonstration at Athens for the
Cretans and Macedonians
Athens, Nov. 12.-An immense meeting of students was held here last evening at which were present a large number of Macedonians and Cretans.The Professor of History of the university made a speech in which he strongly urged the revival of national sentiment on the part of the Macedonians and Cretans and a resolution was passed expressing the readiness of those present to make every sacrifice to liberate Macedonia and Crete.
Everyone can see that Greece didn't discover the term <Macedonia> after 1988,as many Scopians believe.
Let's see now who were those <Macedonians> who immigrated to America and are recorded in the Ellis island lists.The secretary of the Macedonian Commitee of America,Vladimir Andreef Tsanoff send a letter to N.Y.Times,on August 11,1903 and you can read below what he says about the <Macedonians> like him and the famous Ilinden uprise:
http://img261.imageshack.us/my.php?i...can0017vz1.gif
http://img261.imageshack.us/my.php?i...can0018ti8.gif
Some interesting excerpts of Tsanoff's letter:
<The men who are raising the standard of revolt belong to the great masa of Christian peasants and are members of the Bulgarian race to the number of 1100000 in the three villayets of Macedonia...>.
<They are of the same phlegmatic,obdurate,strong-willed race which rules Bulgaria and which is pure Slavonic...>
<The Times speaks of <Bulgarian sojourners in Macedonia>.I presume you mean Macedonian sojourners in Bulgaria.There are 250.000 such,mostly men,whom Turkish misrule has driven from their homes.There are,besides,more than 12.000 refugees who have fled from their burned and pillaged homes across the border into hospitable Bulgaria.But all Macedonians are at home in Bulgaria.It is one nation,the term Macedonian being,as you say,merely a geographical convenience,only that some 1.100.000 of Macedonian Bulgarians are yet under the yoke of the Turk.>
<The Tribune's special correspondent in Macedonia,says:There is no difference between the Bulgarian on either side of the border.

[kostas68]

<History is repeating itself,even under different version>,say many historians and this seems to happen in FYROM:Almost 90 years ago,the ancestors of today's <Macedonians>,who were off course called Bulgarians at this time,were fleeing from Serbian Macedonia to mother Bulgaria.Nowadays,the <Macedonians> of FYROM are asking Bulgarian passports.As every child does,when it needs something,it asks its mother's help.
I found an article of NY Times from 1915,where we can read that <Bulgarian peasants fleeing from Serbian Macedonia have been fired by Serbian frontier guards.>
http://img253.imageshack.us/my.php?image=scan16un1.gif
I want to wish our Scopian friends that we won't see them in the near future fleeing again to Bulgaria under the shots not of the Serbs this time but of their compatriots,the Albanians.

[somebody]

That's True. My Grandparents Lived In Greece And Were Forced To Leave.

[kostas68]

Originally Posted by somebody

That's True. My Grandparents Lived In Greece And Were Forced To Leave.

The newspaper says clearly about Bulgarians who fled from <Serbian Macedonia> to Bulgaria in 1915,not Bulgarians who fled from Greece to FYROM during the Greek civil war 1945-49.

[Ptolemy]

Originally Posted by kostas68

The newspaper says clearly about Bulgarians who fled from <Serbian Macedonia> to Bulgaria in 1915,not Bulgarians who fled from Greece to FYROM during the Greek civil war 1945-49.

Thats true. The following picture shows Bulgarians from Macedonia who are exiled from Serbs.

[pankration]

The above photo indicates to me that past historians used Macedonia as a GEOGRAPHICAL designation and not an ethnic one.

[kostas68]

A very interesting article of NY Times from 16 May 1886,which makes a comparison between the number of the Greek schools in Macedonia with the Bulgarians at this time.It was very difficult to post a clear picture of the whole scaned newspaper and therefore i divided it into 5 parts and i uploaded them on imageshack.
In the 5th pic is the number of the Greek schools in Macedonia:
1)Sandjac of Scopia:9 Greek schools with 319 pupils,44 Bulgarians with 3446 pupils.
2)Sandjac of Bitola: 144 Greek schools with 9608 pupils,77 Bulgarian with 4477 pupils.
3)Sandjac of Salonica: 271 Greek schools with 15.827 pupils,54 Bulgarian schools with 3860 pupils.
4)Sandjac of Serres:160 Greek schools with 7197 pupils,49 Bulgarian schools with 3357 pupils.
5)Sandjac of Drama:81 Greek schools with 3797 pupils.At this time there wasn't Bulgarian schools in Sandjac of Drama.
It's remarkable,as the newspaper writes,that there were Greek schools even in the sandjac of Scopia and that in Bitola the number of the Greek schools and their pupils was double than the Bulgarian.Also we must not forget that in the Ottoman sandjacs of Salonica and Serres were included many regions that nowadays don't belong to Greece but to FYROM or Bulgaria.And notice two phrases.The first is in the 1st pic:<Hellenism,therefore,may be said to have won its game so far as the vox populi is concerned and in virtue of its historic rights to the birthplace of Alexander and Aristotle.>
The second in the 3rd pic:
<Among the rich and among the poor,in every class of the population,every one is prepared for sacrifices,however onerous.The one universal cry is:zito o polemos,zito i Makedonia!(long live the war,long live Macedonia)>
http://profile.imageshack.us/user/ko...8/1886ayh3.gif
http://profile.imageshack.us/user/ko...8/1886bww9.gif
http://profile.imageshack.us/user/ko...8/1886cwc3.gif
http://profile.imageshack.us/user/ko...8/1886dnl8.gif
http://profile.imageshack.us/user/ko...7/1886dxo5.gif

[kostas68]

Boris Sarafof(1872-1907),another well known Bulgarian revolutionary(comitadji)who is claimed by two countries as national hero.Bulgarians consider him as Bulgarian but Scopians claim that he was ethnic<Macedonian>.Who is right?Let's see what a neutral says :

Off course,he was a Macedonian revolutionary...who was trying to provoke the uprising of the Macedonian populations,actually the Bulgarian population of Macedonia,as the NY Times wrote in 1902.
It seems that there weren't at this time any ethnic <Macedonians> in which Sarafof could rely for his revolution,so he addressed to the Bulgarians.