Modern Greeks are not what they think...

[Kassander]

"The inherent instability of the Balkan Peninsula—located as it is at the crossroads of invading Turks, migrating Slavs, and colonizing powers from western or central Europe (Venetians, Austro-Hungarians)—has bequeathed a bewildering amount of cultural confusion to Greece." - Britannica

"One of the most vexing questions concerning the history of medieval Greece has been that of the extent to which the indigenous “Hellenic” population survived and brings with it the question whether this term can properly be used of anything other than a cultural (as opposed to ethnic or racial) identity. The archaeological data, certainly, can offer answers only in terms of cultural similarities and differences, so that the question, as it has been traditionally expressed, of a Hellenic ethnic survival, cannot be answered. The issue must be explored in the context of the influx of large numbers of Slavs during the later 6th–8th centuries as well as the migration across Greece of nomadic or seminomadic pastoral groups such as the Vlachs from the 10th or 11th century and the Albanians from the 13th century. Although the evidence of place-names suggests some lasting Slavic influence in parts of Greece, the evidence is qualified by the fact that the process of re-Hellenization that occurred from the later 8th century seems to have eradicated many traces of Slavic presence. Evidence of tribal names found in both the Peloponnese and northern Greece suggests that there were probably extensive Slavic-speaking populations in many districts; and from the 10th century to the 15th century Slavic occupants of various parts of the Peloponnese appear in the sources as brigands or as fiercely independent warriors. Whereas the Slavs of the south appear to have adopted Greek, those of Macedonia and Thessaly retained their original dialects, becoming only partially Hellenophone in certain districts." - Britannica

"For Christians of the early and middle Byzantine worlds, the terms Hellene and Hellenic generally (although not exclusively, since in certain literary contexts a classicizing style permitted a somewhat different usage) had a pejorative connotation, signifying pagan and non-Christian rather than “Greek.” - Britannica

"Canning (a British politician, 1812-1862) had planned to head off Russia's advance, not by direct opposition, but by associating her with England and France in a policy of emancipation, aimed at erecting national States out of the component parts of the Turkish Empire. Such States could be relied upon to withstand Russian encroachment on their independence, if once they were set free from the Turk. The creation of the Kingdom of Greece was the immediate outcome of Canning's policy" (page 372, Trevelyan, British History in the 19th Century).

"To me, philhellenism is a love affair with a dream which envisions 'Greece' and the 'Greeks' not as an actual place or as real people but as symbols of some imagined perfection" (page 12 Greece without Columns).

"Further back still beyond the War of Independence, when the modern nation-state of Greece came into being for the first time, the whole concept of Greece as a geographical entity that begins to blur before our eyes, so many and various were its shapes and meanings. But if geography can offer us no stable idea of Greece, what can? Not race, certainly; for whatever the Greeks may once have been, ...., they can hardly have had much blood-relationship with the Greeks of the peninsula of today, Serbs and Bulgars, Romans, Franks and Venetians, Turks, Albanians,...,in one invasion after another have made the modern Greeks a decidedly mongrel race. Not politics either; for in spite of that tenacious western legend about Greece as the birthplace and natural home of democracy, the political record of the Greeks is one of a singular instability and confusion in which, throughout history, the poles of anarchy modulated freedom has very rarely appeared. Not religion; for while Byzantium was Christian, ancient Hellas was pagan." (page 23 Greece without Columns).

" the Greek nation-state was a product of western political intervention-'the fatal idea' as Arnold Toynbee once called it, of exclusive western nationalism impinging upon the multi-national traditions of the eastern world. By extension, therefore, at any rate in theory, it was a child of the Renaissance and of western rationalism..." (page 28 Greece without Columns

" its international use to describe the sovereign state that currently occupies that territory is merely a reflection of the fact that 'Greece' in this modern sense is literally a western invention" (page 29 Greece without Columns).

"Greek natural identity was not a 'natural development' or the extension of a 'high culture' over the region of Macedonia, although now it is frequently portrayed as so. The ideology of Hellenism imposed a homogeneity on the Macedonian region and its inhabitants" (page 94, Fields of Wheat, Hills of Blood).

"Modern Greek identity is based on an unshakable conviction that the Greek State is ethnically homogenous. This belief ... has entailed repeated and official denial of the existence of minorities which are not of 'pure' Hellenic origin. The obsession with Greek racial identity involves the distortion of the history of the thousands of years when there was no such thing as a Greek nation state. - Simon McIllwaine

"a sharp and brutal revolution altered the whole character of Hellas... It also involved a steep decline of civilized life and an almost total rejection of former values... The most striking change affected the ethnic composition of the people and resulted from the mass migration of Slavs into the Balkans which began in the sixth Century.” N. Cheetham

"What is the word for this obsessive Greek pseudo-relationship with their country's past (they even have a magazine, Ellenismos, devoted to the subject)? It is not quite pretentiousness. There is too much passion for that. No, the Greeks, the ancient ones, had a word for the modern Greek condition: paranoia. We must accept that Mr Andreas Papandreou (Greek prime minister) and the current EC presidency are the sole legitimate heirs of Pericles, Demosthenes and Aristide the Just. The world must nod dumbly at the proposition that in the veins of the modern Greek ... there courses the blood of Achilles. And their paranoid nationalism is heightened by the tenuousness of that claim." - The Sunday Telegraph, London, March 27,1994

The most usual ideological abuse of history is based on anachronism rather than lies. Greek nationalism refused Macedonia even the right to its name on the grounds that all Macedonia is essentially Greek and part of a Greek nation-State, presumably ever since the father of Alexander the Great, king of Macedonia, became ruler of the Greek lands on the Balkan peninsula ... it takes a lot of courage for a Greek intellectual to say that, historically speaking, it is nonsense. There was no Greek nation-State or any other single political entity for the Greeks in the fourth century B.C.; the Macedonian empire was nothing like the Greek or any other modern nation-state, and in any case it is highly probable that the ancient Greeks regarded the Macedonian rulers, as they did their later Roman rulers, as barbarians and not as Greeks, though they were doubtless too polite or cautious to say so. - Eric Hobsbawn

"It is a striking fact that the leading defenders of Greek liberty at this time were largely Non-Greek. Koundouriotis was decended from the Albanian invadors of Greece in the 14th century,and spoke Greek only with difficulty. His principal colleague was John Kolettis, a Vlakh who had been Ali Pasha's court doctor at Ioannina. One of the few leaders who maintained resistance far to the north of the Gulf of Corinth was the Souliote,Marko Botsaris,whos followers were largely Albanian. By a strange chance, it happend that two of the Turkish commanders-in-chief during the war, Khurshid Pasha and Muhammad Rehid Pasha(known to the Greeks as Kiutahi), were by birth Orthodox Christians, who had been converted to Islam for the sake of career in the Sultans service." - C.M. Woodhouse
Greece included considerably fewer than half of those who regarded themselves as Greeks by virtue of their language,their religion, and (less plausibly) their race. It was easy to stir up agitation in favour of enlarging Greece's frontiers by a progressive extension of "enosis" (union).

"Greek demographic continuity was brutally interrupted in the late sixth to eighth centuries A.D. by massive influxes of Avar, Slav and later, Albanian immigrants......modern Greeks could hardly count as being of ancient Greek descent, even if this could never be ruled out.” - Anthony Smith

The sooner you realize you are not pure descendants of the Hellenes the sooner we can stop this bickering & begin being constructive with one another Balkan Orthodox cousins.

[admin]

if you do not have specific references ie page numbers, volume number etc your posts WILL be deleted... I will give you 1 day to do this

[akritas]

Welcome kassander in the Macedonia On the Web.
As I see you speak for the continuity of the Greeks. What proof do you want by linguistically or genetically?

and please change your avatar

[admin]

Why are is all Artifactual evidence in Greece and not in Bitola? Can you explain why ALL the ancient artifacts, the tombs of Philip and other macedonian kings

Read about the burial sites of the ancient Macedonian kings which are located in the museums in Vergina Macedonia, Northern Greece. Of particular note are the tombs of the royal dynasty, most notably King Philip II, relics from his funeral pyre, and his royal coach.
http://www.macedonian-heritage.gr/Mu..._Berginas.html

http://www.macedonian-heritage.gr/Mu...rx_Pellas.html

http://www.macedonian-heritage.gr/He...n/gallery.html
All the ancient artifacts from Alexander

http://rg.ancients.info/alexander/portrait.html
why all coins from Alexander are Greek even from the BC age


and all these are all in Greece?

Are you sure your nation has ITS identity in order???

[admin]

The large, gold sarcophagus found in the main chamber of `Philip's tomb', Vergina, GREECE.

just a taste...

you may post interesting propaganda on your site and confuse SOME people, HOWEVER the facts the artifacts and the history all lie in GREECE.
That Can NEVER be changed...

[akritas]

Originally Posted by Kassander

"Greek demographic continuity was brutally interrupted in the late sixth to eighth centuries A.D. by massive influxes of Avar, Slav and later, Albanian immigrants......modern Greeks could hardly count as being of ancient Greek descent, even if this could never be ruled out.” - Anthony Smith

Are you Slav, Avar or later kassander?

[admin]

Originally Posted by akritas

Are you Slav, Avar or later kassander?

lmao

I guess they are TRUE ancient Macedonians once they arrived in the 8th century AD and were Slav, Avar, or later....

[goldblood]

whered the bulgarian go? hes probably looking for some evidence to support those m......s and cant find shit haha he never will..

poor dumb skop

[akritas]

You know what is the problem with their argyments goldblood. That they don't know what they want to be or was to be.
For exaple some times claimed that they are Slavs.. Not from the 6th A.D. but vaptized Slavonic tribe the Illyrian,Thracian, Peonian and of course the Macedonian. The new "fruit" is that and the Pelasgians were Slavs

[goldblood]

i think i knwo another thing that adds to their confusion is that they are told what to think their whole lives and when they read the truth it hurts.. it hurts real bad . im from a part of greece that really had nothing to do with this whole issue.. my dad never heard of this shit growing up in greece and pretty much was educated on the issue hes read on the issue after leaving greece, and i am from sources that are credible.. on the contrary their main source of knowledge is what their commie babar(grandmother in bulgarian) has told them and all the bullshit fantacism that has been passed down. how can you teach a person that has been bread to hate? we dont hate cause we have the proof.. we laugh at them but they are the ones with the hate cause thats the only thing that fuels their bullshit.