Hi everyone!

[Αλέξανδρος ο' Μέγας]

Hello, my name is Andrea, I'm from Italy and just like you i'm fascinated about Alexander the Great.

I hope that on this forum we will discuss everything about this fantastic human being. I have read a book on him, "Alexander the Great son of the gods", by Alan Fildes and Joann Fletcher..an accurate historical cronicle spanning from his birth to his controversial death.

Furthermore, I'm waiting to reach 5 posts to finally post some pictures in the tread dedicated to his phisical appearance...I will be patient.

Ciao from Italy, and see you soon around here! :)

[Tsontos]

Hi Andrea. I own that book too. Had alot of interesting bits and peices about his campaigns and life which I'd never heard about.

[pankration]

Hello, my name is Andrea, I'm from Italy and just like you i'm fascinated about Alexander the Great.

I hope that on this forum we will discuss everything about this fantastic human being. I have read a book on him, "Alexander the Great son of the gods", by Alan Fildes and Joann Fletcher..an accurate historical cronicle spanning from his birth to his controversial death.

Furthermore, I'm waiting to reach 5 posts to finally post some pictures in the tread dedicated to his phisical appearance...I will be patient.

Ciao from Italy, and see you soon around here! :)

Welcome. :clapping:Italy is a beautiful and quite varied country. I've been pretty well all over it and I love the food, the people, the culture and the history. Of course, being married to an Italian prejudices me a bit. If you like reading about Alexander, this is a great site. Try pothos.org too. There are some hard ass scholars on that site but they do examine a lot of Alexander's life that traditionalists ignore. They've set me right a couple of times. Check out my websites for more info (the signatures below).

[Αλέξανδρος ο' Μέγας]

Thank you for your welcome!

I presume that the greater part of us here is Greek eh? Well, well, beatiful people you are! As much mediterrean as us!

In fact, I see some topics regarding Alexander's roots: Albania, Macedonia, Greece..very interesting

[Tsontos]

Yes your right Andrea! As you can see Alexander's legacy still plays on the minds of Balkan states such as Greece, The Former Yugoslav Republic of "Macedonia" and Albania.

[Mirmidon]

Thank you for your welcome!

I presume that the greater part of us here is Greek eh? Well, well, beatiful people you are! As much mediterrean as us!

In fact, I see some topics regarding Alexander's roots: Albania, :eek:?Macedonia?:eek:, Greece..very interesting

Macedonia is Greece mate.

[Αλέξανδρος ο' Μέγας]

Macedonia is Greece mate.
Very true, but as far as my knowledge goes at Alexander's time there was a debate over Macedonia being a barbarian region or not.

[Mirmidon]

Very true, but as far as my knowledge goes at Alexander's time there was a debate over Macedonia being a barbarian region or not.
what do you mean?
can you explain me?
You can read this Carefully
Answer from Akritas & Flipper in other forum
http://www.allempires.net/forum_posts.asp?TID=15134

and this

http://www.macedoniaontheweb.com/forum/ancient-macedonian-history/

You must read..:clap2:

[Αλέξανδρος ο' Μέγας]

Well, I just meant the prejudice of people from region such as Attica. As I read in "Alexander Son of the Gods":

"Although the Macedonians spoke a Greek dialect, worshiped Greek gods, and traced their nation's origins from Macedon, son of Zeus, their customs and northern Doric accent were markedly different from those of the people of the rest of Greece, who saw Macedonia as a largely insignificant, backward monarchy, to be looked upon with suspicion".

The fact that Macedonia is part of Greece is no matter of discussion, I do not dare something even near that. But there is, as I see, some debate about how Macedonians were perceived by southern Greeks, as true Greeks or Caucasic semi-barbarian people. That's it, nothing eretic I think! :clap2:

[pankration]

Well, I just meant the prejudice of people from region such as Attica. As I read in "Alexander Son of the Gods":

"Although the Macedonians spoke a Greek dialect, worshiped Greek gods, and traced their nation's origins from Macedon, son of Zeus, their customs and northern Doric accent were markedly different from those of the people of the rest of Greece, who saw Macedonia as a largely insignificant, backward monarchy, to be looked upon with suspicion".

The fact that Macedonia is part of Greece is no matter of discussion, I do not dare something even near that. But there is, as I see, some debate about how Macedonians were perceived by southern Greeks, as true Greeks or Caucasic semi-barbarian people. That's it, nothing eretic I think! :clap2:

You're quite right in your statements so no need to apologize. The Athenians thought everyone was inferior, the Spartans thought they were tougher than anyone and every city-state at one time or another fought with another. Some were even allied with Xerxes and Darius I and II. This doesn't mean they weren't Greek. At times we Greeks can be a bit dysfunctional in our "family" relationships.
Here's an Italian comparison. Northern Italians think that they run the country. They are more industrious, make more money, are more employed and pay more taxes. Ask a Northerner about Calabria or Sicily and they will turn up their noses. They think that the South are in essence, barbarians. But everyone is still Italian. I know that this opinion is stereotyping but you know it to be true. My in-laws (from Calabria) experienced it many times right in front of me as did my wife in Rome. So you see, Greeks aren
t alone, and Macedonia will always be Greek.

[Tsontos]

Well, I just meant the prejudice of people from region such as Attica. As I read in "Alexander Son of the Gods":

"Although the Macedonians spoke a Greek dialect, worshiped Greek gods, and traced their nation's origins from Macedon, son of Zeus, their customs and northern Doric accent were markedly different from those of the people of the rest of Greece, who saw Macedonia as a largely insignificant, backward monarchy, to be looked upon with suspicion".

The fact that Macedonia is part of Greece is no matter of discussion, I do not dare something even near that. But there is, as I see, some debate about how Macedonians were perceived by southern Greeks, as true Greeks or Caucasic semi-barbarian people. That's it, nothing eretic I think! :clap2:

Being an Italian you know enough about regionalism and regional pride obstructing relations between people of the same ethnicity. The problem today, and as you may have noticed it's made Greeks quite sensitive about the topic of ancient Macedonia, is that the nationalist Slavs from the Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia, who have nothing to do with Macedonia or Greece in general have attempted to claim the ancient Macedonians as Slavs themselves! As you can see it's also political issue unfortunately.

[Truth Bearer]

Don't forget the southern Greeks also didn't rate the Epireans.......Every city sate considered itself superior than the rest the rivalry was tremendous and in many cases the city states aligned themselves with a foreigner for political or economical gain.The retribution b/w the Greeks was terrible during wars and sieges........

[Αλέξανδρος ο' Μέγας]

I'm Italian, yes, and moreover from Apulia, at the very south of Italy, so I know what prejudice and regionalism means, yes.
I just want to make clear that I don't intend to open a debate about Macedonia being Greece or not, it would be an odd way to introduce myself; I'm just discussing about the various debate upon Alexander's roots: Greece, Slav as being from Macedonia in the north, Albanian, Extraterrestrial and so on.

I must beg your pardon anyway, without malice I opened up a delicate topic with political implications. That shows us anyway that history made even more than 2000 years ago is not far away from us, but it can be still considered actual, and that's why we are all here commenting the enterpises of one of the greatest human being who ever lived.

[pankration]

Again, you don't need our pardon. You asked good questions, showed an open mind and responded in a scholarly and polite manner. I wish everyone on this site (sometimes even me) always took the time you did.

[Αλέξανδρος ο' Μέγας]

Thank you pankration, for what I see I'm confident that I will find myself very well here.

P.S.
I see you were an all around fighter...well I have on my shoulders 5 years of Aikido and Daito-Ryu, 3 of Ju-jutsu and 3 as an amateur boxer and I find your websites very interesting.
I didn't get it anyway, did you actually wrote an historical novel about a pankration practicer?

[Andrew]

Ciao Andrea e benvenuto nel nostro forum !!!!1

Io sono un Greco studente a Ferrara, mi chiamo Andrea anch'io , ò se vuoi Andreas , in greco , percio , quando vuoi possiamo parlare anche in italiano ...

BENVENUTO !!!

[Αλέξανδρος ο' Μέγας]

Ciao Andrea e benvenuto nel nostro forum !!!!1

Io sono un Greco studente a Ferrara, mi chiamo Andrea anch'io , ò se vuoi Andreas , in greco , percio , quando vuoi possiamo parlare anche in italiano ...

BENVENUTO !!!

Grazie Andrea!!

We should carry on with English in respect of others, but we could maybe exchange msn contacts of you have one. I'll send you a message.

[Truth Bearer]

Thank you pankration, for what I see I'm confident that I will find myself very well here.

P.S.
I see you were an all around fighter...well I have on my shoulders 5 years of Aikido and Daito-Ryu, 3 of Ju-jutsu and 3 as an amateur boxer and I find your websites very interesting.
I didn't get it anyway, did you actually wrote an historical novel about a pankration practicer?


Yes he has written a book about a pankration Olympic champion who went with Alexander III.

PATRIDA A Novel of the Pankration
http://www.pankration-novel-patrida.com/sitebuilder/images/book_side_view-178x287.jpg

Go here to read more
http://www.macedoniaontheweb.com/forum/macedonia-ideas-essays/1188-next-great-novel.html

[Αλέξανδρος ο' Μέγας]

Well, just great :clapping:

[Morpheus]

Hi, I would just like to ask - what was the name of Alexander's kingdom? Greece or Macedonia?

[Morphesau]

Hi, I would just like to ask - what was the name of Alexander's kingdom? Greece or Macedonia?

Read real history and decide.


Strabo
Geography
p321 Book VII, Fragments472

http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/Roman/Texts/Strabo/7Fragments*.html


Macedonia, of course, is a part of Greece, yet now, since I am following the nature and shape of the places geographically, I have decided to classify it apart from the rest of Greece and to join it with that part of Thrace which borders on it and extends as far as the mouth of the Euxine and the Propontis. Then, p329a little further on, Strabo mentions Cypsela and the Hebrus River, and also describes a sort of parallelogram in which the whole of Macedonia lies.

[Morpheus]

A simple answer would be enough - was Alexander's kingdom named Macedonia or Greece? Just one word, please!

[Morphesau]

A simple answer would be enough - was Alexander's kingdom named Macedonia or Greece? Just one word, please!

Part of the Hellenic Tribes, if you disagree ? Prove us wrong...

[Morpheus]

A simple answer would be enough - was Alexander's kingdom named Macedonia or Greece? Just one word, please!
Once again - no maps, Strabo's or something... Greece or Macedonia?

[Morphesau]

Once again - no maps, Strabo's or something... Greece or Macedonia?

But do you understand what "Hellenic tribes" means ? it's important that you do first, because no one in their right mind would question the two.

Same as asking, FYROM or Bulgaria ? = Same..

Here is my proof.
http://illyria.proboards19.com/index.cgi?board=makedoniamacedonia&action=display&thread=1192945034

Invitation from the central Bulgarian revolutionary commitee BMPO to all Bulgars in Skopje....
Translation:"YOU, Bulgarian, in the name of the patriotism, freedom and saving your life, pay to the bearer of this invitation the sum of ... "

See Bulgarian "SVOBODA"

:) :) :)

[Morpheus]

But do you understand what "Hellenic tribes" means ? it's important that you do first, because no one in their right mind would question the two.

Same as asking saying FYROM or Bulgaria ? = Same..

Here is my proof.
http://illyria.proboards19.com/index.cgi?board=makedoniamacedonia&action=display&thread=1192945034

:) :) :)
OK, let's simplify - I don't understand what Hellenic tribes means. Now, can you answer my question without a question? Macedonian or Greek kingdom?

[Morpheus]

But do you understand what "Hellenic tribes" means ? it's important that you do first, because no one in their right mind would question the two.

Same as asking saying FYROM or Bulgaria ? = Same..

Here is my proof.
http://illyria.proboards19.com/index.cgi?board=makedoniamacedonia&action=display&thread=1192945034

Invitation from the central Bulgarian revolutionary commitee BMPO to all Bulgars in Skopje....
Translation:"YOU, Bulgarian, in the name of the patriotism, freedom and saving your life, pay to the bearer of this invitation the sum of ... "

See Bulgarian "SVOBODA"

:) :) :)

OK, let's simplify - I don't really understand what Hellenic tribes means, allthough I would like to know something more.

Now, can I get an actual answer in the form different then question? Macedonian or Greek kingdom?

[Morpheus]

OK, I guess you can't answer without question... Nevermind...

[Morphesau]

OK, I guess you can't answer without question... Nevermind...

Gotcha. You're not very clever. ;)

[Morpheus]

Gotcha. You're not very clever. ;)
Well, you aren't either. Still no answer - Alexander's kingdom was named Macedonia or Greece? Why is it so complicated to answer a simple question?

[Amarantos]

FOR THE FREEDOM AND THE GLORY OF GREECE!!!. You are quite fond of american "productions" ;)
And how was it that the era after his death was called.And what did he spread around the world?

[Morphesau]

Well, you aren't either. Still no answer - Alexander's kingdom was named Macedonia or Greece? Why is it so complicated to answer a simple question?

First they were Hellenic tribes, such as Sparta, Athenians etc; Got it now ? That is why you have to understand what Hellenic tribes were. And you avoided it like the plague.

The correct answer would be Greece, you had to undetsand what the Hellenic tribes were first for me to go further.

Hellenic city states were united under Philip "Alexanders father" leadership. Correct ? Now let's see if you answer ?

[Morpheus]

First they were Hellenic tribes, such as Sparta, Athenians etc; Got it now ? That is why you have to understand what Hellenic tribes were. And you avoided it like the plague.

The correct answer would be Greece, you had to undetsand what the Hellenic tribes were first for me to go further.

Hellenic city states were united under Philip "Alexanders father" leadership. Correct ? Now let's see if you answer ?
I will answer in your style - who did the Macedonians defeated at Heraklea?

[Morphesau]

I will answer in your style - who did the Macedonians defeated at Heraklea?

You didn't answer me again. The above question of yours is usless because if you fail to understand what the Hellenic tribes were about then you're lost.

You prove my piont....

[Morpheus]

OK, did Philip defeated the Hellenic tribes? YES! (don't even try to argue that)
Did he united them? Isn't he responsible for the uniting of the Greeks (Hellens)? And was he a Greek (Hellen)? Have in mind what Demosten said...

[Andrew]

Once again - no maps, Strabo's or something... Greece or Macedonia?

There wasn't any Greek State back then ..only Greek Nation composed by
greek Tribes !!!!

In the same way that there wasn't Illyrian state but Illyrian tribes like , Bylliones, Dardanes , Aytariates , Parthini , Encheleis ....

So Alexander's kigdom was the kigdom of the Greek tribe of the Makedones named Makedonia.
...In the same way as the Kingdom of Diomedes was Argos , that of Idomeneus was the Kingdom of Crete ...and in the same way Athens was a greek city-state , composed mainly by Ionians .

[Andrew]

Hi, I would just like to ask - what was the name of Alexander's kingdom? Greece or Macedonia?

What was the island of Pythagoras Greece or Samos ?????

[Morpheus]

There wasn't any Greek State back then ..only Greek Nation composed by
greek Tribes !!!!

In the same way that there wasn't Illyrian state but Illyrian tribes like , Bylliones, Dardanes , Aytariates , Parthini , Encheleis ....

So Alexander's kigdom was the kigdom of the Greek tribe of the Makedones named Makedonia.
...In the same way as the Kingdom of Diomedes was Argos , that of Idomeneus was the Kingdom of Crete ...and in the same way Athens was a greek city-state , composed mainly by Ionians .
But Philip encapsuleted these tribes in a Macedonian kingdom, right? And defeated and conquered Greek tribes, no? And?

[Morpheus]

And?

[Andrew]

And?

Philip never conquered other greek tribes !!!!
The only exceptions were Methone and some Khalkidide cities , and that because they were close to Pella !!

He vassaled barbarians (Paeonians,Illyrian,Thracians)

and Became the chief-general of the greek-alliance against Persia

Inizialy , it was the Thessalians (the Alevads from Larissa) who invited him to be their "tagos" = military commander in their conflicts with the Magnesians and the Phoceans. and when they gave him their votes in the Amphiktyonic council he became "chairman" of the Amphictyony so was the official "protector" of the Delphian oracle. The wars against Phoceans were not conquering ones ,but he wanted to panish them because they looted the greek "holy land".
In Epeirus he "instituted" Alexander IV as king , which was let's say "his agent", but didn't conquered it.
In Athens , although his coalition won in Chaerone (Macedonians ,Thessalians etc) vs. Athenians,Thebans ,etc he treated them with the greatest rispect.The win of Chaeronea permitted him to unify Greece , that is proclaim COMMON PEACE (see Isokrates) and not conquering. So under Philip the Greeks stopped fighting each other.

Philip was King of Macedonia and Chief General of The Greeks and never
altered these roles !!!

BTW ..you never answered me ..What was the island of Pythagoras Greece or Samos ??

[pankration]

Thank you pankration, for what I see I'm confident that I will find myself very well here.

P.S.
I see you were an all around fighter...well I have on my shoulders 5 years of Aikido and Daito-Ryu, 3 of Ju-jutsu and 3 as an amateur boxer and I find your websites very interesting.
I didn't get it anyway, did you actually wrote an historical novel about a pankration practicer?

Interestingly enough I was teaching an MMA style of fighting (I called it Pankration as an honor to my Greek heritage) 25 years ago. I too boxed (and was hammered by a future world champion, he was only 12 and I was an adult:clap2:).
My book is a novelization of two streams of history: Philip's assassination and the development of Dioxippus, the greatest pankratiatist of history. Read the free sample on my website for an introduction to the story.

[pankration]

I'm not sure what Morpheus is on about? Is there something I missed? There was no Greece as an entity that we would call a country today. Alexander and his father before him were kings of Macedonia, a Greek city state like Athens, Sparta or Thebes. Philip saw a need, for personal or nationalistic gain, to unite the fraticidal groups in geographic and cultural Greece. Some liked it; some didn't and a short war broke out. He won with his Greek allies against other Greeks. He became the leader of the Greek league but did not conquer Greece. Neither did Alexander. That is why the Hellenic culture spread so far so fast and so long: Greece was not taken over by Alexander or anyone else during his lifetime. And as a Greek Macedonian, his heart and brain were Hellenic. This is indisputable and has been for two thousand years. So what's your point Morpheus?

[Truth Bearer]

His official title was Alexander III Argois King of all Hellenes............