Greece not happy with canada over Macedonia name issue

[Greece2006]

Thursday, September 20, 2007 at 12:48
Subject: /Greece-Diplomacy/Canada/Macedonia/

Greece "not happy" with Canada over Macedonia name issue

Athens (dpa) - Greece expressed its displeasure on Thursday with Canada's decision to recognise the former Yugoslav republic of Macedonia as Macedonia, the name rejected by Athens for nearly two decades.

"The decision by Canada and other countries to recognise the former Yogoslav Republic of Macedonia as Macedonia for bilateral purposes, knowing negotiations are still ongoing on an international level, - does not make us happy," said Greek Foreign Ministry Spokesperson Giorgos Koumoutsakos during a press briefing.

"Canada's announcement certainly does not make the thousands of Greek-Canadians living in Canada happy," Koumoutsakos added.

Athens refers to the nation of Macedonia by the acronym FYROM - Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia - under which it entered the United Nations in 1993.

Athens says that the name Macedonia implies a claim by FYROM on the northern Greek province of Macedonia, the historic home of Alexander the Great, which could destabilize the region.

The spokesperson said Greek Foreign Minister Dora Bakoyanni will contact her Canadian counterpart later in the day to express Greece's position.

The name dispute between Greece and its neighbour is among the top foreign policy issues which Athens plans to tackle under the newly re-elected conservative government.

Athens has opposed the name "Macedonia" since the neighbouring republic broke away from socialist Yugoslavia in 1991. Since then both countries have been involved in UN-led negotiations in order to find a name acceptable between both sides but with little progress.

Canada is among the list of other countries, namely the United States, Russia and China which now use the name "Macedonia" in their bilateral relations. But NATO, the European Union and the United Nations still use the term Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia.

In his pre-election campaign, newly re-elected Prime Minister Costas Karamanlis said Greece would block its neighbour's bid to join NATO and the EU if it tries to join under the disputed name.

[achilles]

From what i heard, Canada did that in order to put pressure to Greece towards a final resolution of the dispute. Of course, upon negotiations with the US.

The battle of the name has been lost. Irrespective of the final resolution of the dispute, FYROM will be always referred to by most countries as...Macedonia.

[pankration]

Greece doesn't give a crap about what Canada thinks. If Canadian politicians think that their recognition of FYROM will pressure the Greeks, then they are bigger morons than the electorate already think they are.

[Makedonia25]

Greece doesn't give a crap about what Canada thinks. If Canadian politicians think that their recognition of FYROM will pressure the Greeks, then they are bigger morons than the electorate already think they are.

+1! :clapping::clap2:

[GreekSlav]

+1! :clapping::clap2:

Well, you are too late. There are already many Greeks that have been moved by this news from Canada. I guess it bothers many Greeks afterall. It's too bad that these Greeks have nothing else to worry about.

It's funny how Greece must officially respond to such news. Why don't they realize that not responding at all makes for a better effect on this issue?

[Euklid]

Well, you are too late. There are already many Greeks that have been moved by this news from Canada. I guess it bothers many Greeks afterall. It's too bad that these Greeks have nothing else to worry about.

It's funny how Greece must officially respond to such news. Why don't they realize that not responding at all makes for a better effect on this issue?
From what you can tell from this thread alone, Greeks are not touched by these news, after all we are all aware that international recognition will not legitimize their nationalistic propaganda, and thats just it, however it does provide a fertile ground for the continuation of the propaganda.

[PhiliptheUniterchaeronea]

Well, you are too late. There are already many Greeks that have been moved by this news from Canada. I guess it bothers many Greeks afterall. It's too bad that these Greeks have nothing else to worry about.

It's funny how Greece must officially respond to such news. Why don't they realize that not responding at all makes for a better effect on this issue?

Please explain Slav. I do not understand what you mean. I do understand you are trying to provoke, but I still do not understand some of your points.

As for being Greek, lets drop the pretense, it may not be as embarrassing as the front your people show, but lets be gentlemen and debate as such. I would prefer to learn from you as opposed to name calling in the sandbox.

[Spartan]

No one really gives a cr*p what Canada does because it has absolutely no international pull or authority.

GreekSlav, the repercussions for the present ruling party in Canada will be severe! The Greeks have huge numbers in Canada and can cause havoc and destruction for anyone who disrespects them.

[Spartan]

No one really gives a cr*p what Canada does because it has absolutely no international pull or authority.

GreekSlav, the repercussions for the present ruling party in Canada will be severe! The Greeks have huge numbers in Canada and can cause havoc and destruction for anyone who disrespects them.

[GreekSlav]

From what you can tell from this thread alone, Greeks are not touched by these news, after all we are all aware that international recognition will not legitimize their nationalistic propaganda, and thats just it, however it does provide a fertile ground for the continuation of the propaganda.

Of course Greeks are touched by this Canadien issue. Some are upset and some say so what! Just look at the subject of this thread and you immediately know some Greeks are affected. And you are right, international recognition will not legitimize the propaganda coming from ROM. It's all hogwash. But recognizing them under their constitutional name has nothing to do with legitimizing or continuing their propaganda.

Once others stop responding to this propaganda, the faster issues can be resolved. Afterall, we all know who ancient Greek history belongs to. Or does some Greeks (those that respond to their propaganda) have doubts????

[GreekSlav]

Please explain Slav. I do not understand what you mean. I do understand you are trying to provoke, but I still do not understand some of your points.

As for being Greek, lets drop the pretense, it may not be as embarrassing as the front your people show, but lets be gentlemen and debate as such. I would prefer to learn from you as opposed to name calling in the sandbox.


If you consider my opinions as provocation, then you sliver and slime like a snake to come up with reasons to slam me. Opinions are just that but since mine does not conform blindly but consists of free thought, you accuse me of provocation. It is you that provoke, so deal with the opinions like a man instead of whimpering like a child. If you can not, then do not bother responding.

[GreekSlav]

If you consider my opinions as provocation, then you sliver and slime like a snake to come up with reasons to slam me. Opinions are just that but since mine does not conform blindly but consists of free thought, you accuse me of provocation. It is you that provoke, so deal with the opinions like a man instead of whimpering like a child. If you can not, then do not bother responding.


I do not understand what you mean by "my people". Please explain.

[Istor]

But recognizing them under their constitutional name has nothing to do with legitimizing or continuing their propaganda.

Recognition will make SlavoSkopians' Macedonism self-evident. They will need no propaganda machine to convince peoples on earth that they are 'Macedonians'.

[GreekSlav]

Recognition will make SlavoSkopians' Macedonism self-evident. They will need no propaganda machine to convince peoples on earth that they are 'Macedonians'.

They never did need the propaganda for those countries to recognize them under their constitutional name. No legitimate entity would listen to this propaganda. Canada did not. But they did see enough legitimate information to accept their name.

[Euklid]

Of course Greeks are touched by this Canadien issue. Some are upset and some say so what! Just look at the subject of this thread and you immediately know some Greeks are affected. And you are right, international recognition will not legitimize the propaganda coming from ROM. It's all hogwash. But recognizing them under their constitutional name has nothing to do with legitimizing or continuing their propaganda.

Once others stop responding to this propaganda, the faster issues can be resolved. Afterall, we all know who ancient Greek history belongs to. Or does some Greeks (those that respond to their propaganda) have doubts????
There are many occasions that Greeks have to sit down and explain to foreigners that Macedonia is a region of Greece. This is very annoying, and their recognition only supplies them with attitude to press even harder the propaganda they fuel the internet with.

No doubts whatsoever.

[PhiliptheUniterchaeronea]

If you consider my opinions as provocation, then you sliver and slime like a snake to come up with reasons to slam me. Opinions are just that but since mine does not conform blindly but consists of free thought, you accuse me of provocation. It is you that provoke, so deal with the opinions like a man instead of whimpering like a child. If you can not, then do not bother responding.

Grow up. Of course you are provoking. I can't help but feel sorry for you, but what can I do to help you be a gentleman? First, I will suspend you for a week for calling me a snake. As for me being a man. Anytime you see fit, I will meet you face to face. I will not go in swinging, but will shake your hand and ask we speak as gentlemen. I can not understand how you do not understand this. I for one grow extremely weary of Slavs beating their chests and acting tough. Then you try and take a pious attitude and accuse me of the sins you commit. A shame really, I was hoping to be able to communicate with you. Please return in a week, and we can speak as gentlemen. If you prefer to continue with this macho nonsense, then we can't really go forward. I for one will meet you face to face and discuss anything as a gentleman.

Slav, you are suspended one week starting today. Please return and we can move forward. Regards to you.

[pankration]

The trouble with these Slavic agitators is that they are incapable of accepting someone else's opinion and must always respond with belligerence.
Greekslav, Philip has treated you like a gentleman and your over-reaction only proves the stereotypical Slavic mind: limited and bigoted. I look forward to your return as your stupidities are quite entertaining. The only thing I fear is that during your suspension you might actually come to your senses but not likely.
By the way, you can call me anything you want. Insults from you or your cronies are those of petulant children so go ahead and stamp your feet and cry. Just try to remember that those on this site (excluding me) have treated you with respect and you returned that respect with vitriol.

[Victor]

Slav, you are suspended one week starting today. Please return and we can move forward. Regards to you.Its about time!!! :clapping:
A week is ok but if it was up to me,I would have suspended him for an eternity.;)

[GreekSlav]

It does not matter how I deal with any subject. The fact is that you have tried to narrow my thoughts to pro-Greek only, and any views of mine that goes againest it will always be considered provocative. But I am different than you. I am a very strong Greek and have my views, for and againest, and nothing anyone will do would ever change that.

So learn what it really is like being Greek. To be free of thought, mind, and speech is what our ancient Greek ancestors gave us, that so many of you have forgotten.

Grow some nuts and stop being afraid of speaking your mind, both for and againest, not always for. Such weakness.

Deal with me as you wish. If you want, delete my account. I promise I won't cry.

[Spartan]

It does not matter how I deal with any subject. The fact is that you have tried to narrow my thoughts to pro-Greek only, and any views of mine that goes againest it will always be considered provocative. But I am different than you. I am a very strong Greek and have my views, for and againest, and nothing anyone will do would ever change that.

So learn what it really is like being Greek. To be free of thought, mind, and speech is what our ancient Greek ancestors gave us, that so many of you have forgotten.


No GreekSlav we just expect your views as an "open-minded free-thinker" to be one of Logic and rationall, not spite because you disagree with Greek positions on such matters! As for OUR ancestors we defend ourselves when attacked by outsiders! We are the origin of history and we will defend OUR history until the day we die. The Ancient Greeks would take offense to your lack of defense for Greece and its history.

[GreekSlav]

What is appalling is the "communist" way of dealing with an outspoken Greek. Many posts directed at me are soaked with "Trolling" and nothing is said. Yet my outspoken posts are tagged as "trolling", telling me that none of you are capable of having a civilized discussion or debate on those outspoken posts. So you delete them or ban me. A comment was posted about killing my descendents, yet that post is still "alive". How can have a dialogue with any of you? My free thought is met with accusations of trolling, which is a great example of a clandestine campaign againest free speech here. What you want me to do is align with all your ideas and thoughts, which is a great example of blind conformity.

[Foti66]

What is appalling is the "communist" way of dealing with an outspoken Greek. Many posts directed at me are soaked with "Trolling" and nothing is said. Yet my outspoken posts are tagged as "trolling", telling me that none of you are capable of having a civilized discussion or debate on those outspoken posts. So you delete them or ban me. A comment was posted about killing my descendents, yet that post is still "alive". How can have a dialogue with any of you? My free thought is met with accusations of trolling, which is a great example of a clandestine campaign againest free speech here. What you want me to do is align with all your ideas and thoughts, which is a great example of blind conformity.

No bonehead, you are wrong. No one asked you to align with anyones ideas and thoughts. What is required of you is that you take a logical stance in presenting your arguments. You come off as a typical third world balkanite simply blowing things out of your ass. What exactly are you expecting? respect and acknowledgment?

[Makedonia22]

What is appalling is the "communist" way of dealing with an outspoken Greek. Many posts directed at me are soaked with "Trolling" and nothing is said. Yet my outspoken posts are tagged as "trolling", telling me that none of you are capable of having a civilized discussion or debate on those outspoken posts. So you delete them or ban me. A comment was posted about killing my descendents, yet that post is still "alive". How can have a dialogue with any of you? My free thought is met with accusations of trolling, which is a great example of a clandestine campaign againest free speech here. What you want me to do is align with all your ideas and thoughts, which is a great example of blind conformity.

How about you start debating? I haven't seen you even try. All I see from you are complaints and opinions but no debating.

[Draco]

How about you start debating? I haven't seen you even try. All I see from you are complaints and opinions but no debating.
To debate with someone you have to be open to the possibility that you are wrong. Slav here just pops up, drops an unreferenced statement and anyone who disagrees is treated as irrational.

[GreekSlav]

No bonehead, you are wrong. No one asked you to align with anyones ideas and thoughts. What is required of you is that you take a logical stance in presenting your arguments. You come off as a typical third world balkanite simply blowing things out of your ass. What exactly are you expecting? respect and acknowledgment?

You do not have to ask. Your actions here are just subtle ways of "steering" the weak. I am not weak. I am completely sure of my views.

I do not expect anything from any of you except some logical discussions. All I get are accusations. How can I give you a logical stance when you can not understand one when you see one, and only accuse me of trolling? None of you have shown any capability of discussing or debating. All I see is glorifying Greekness and slamming anyone that gets in the way. I do not have to glorify my Greekness on these forums because I am totally sure of it. So what I am trying to do is have a logical debate. I already have logical stances but no one to hear them. Your ears are hard-wired to direct logical stances that do not conform to yours in one ear and out the other.

And then some of you dare to ask me questions, when I only know that my logical stances to your questions will only be ridiculed and dissected into little pieces to through around the forum and laughed at by little boys!

Step up to the plate or else sit in the dugout and watch.

[Makedonia22]

Greekslav what are you doing up so late, its 4am in Kurdistan isn't it?

[Victor]

I am completely sure of my views.
Its a miracle,God is a member of our forum!:lol:

[Victor]

Greekslav what are you doing up so late, its 4am in Kurdistan isn't it?He now has lots of free time because he wiped out al-kaeda all by himself.:blast::gun_thug::notworthy:banana:

[makedon]

Greek Slav, you are one confused sheep and full of shit too, you are a troll,
nothing more, normally I do not bother even conversing with people like you.

Which part of Greece are you from, which town ?

What is your beef ?

You put out a lot of baloney.
The Greeks did this the Greeks did that.
Greeks from Southern Greece, ie., Athens did shit.

Go read some of my responses to Masolord
to learn some indisputable history.

FYROM is a COMMUNIST swine country, and Canadian Politicians know it.
You cry babies are all products of your Commie country and/or Commie Family.

[PhiliptheUniterchaeronea]

Why is it when anyone disagrees with you GS, they are boys, communinist or something inferior to what you and your beliefs are? Why is it you accuse everyone else of the sins and characteristics you posses? Please, lets slow down and be gentlemen. If not, it will be the same pattern of trolling and losing of tempers. Surely the juvenille behaviour can end here with us, GS, what do you say? Do we move forward, or will it be the same patterns. I have ignored your provocations, I am not better than anyone else here, so lets all do it.

[pankration]

GS, I have of course read many of your posts and quite frankly I don't find them as offensive as others on this forum. The problem is that you express views but rarely offer evidence to support them. Then you get angry and snipe. In fact, the most eloquent you've been is in your latest posts where you complain. I believe that Greeks like everyone else cannot pretend things didn't happen and we can't fall into the trap of being revisionists. But we have a lot to be proud of and I for one will be damned when someone throws bricks without showing me a good reason. GS, you can write, you can think...just make sure that a voiced opinion has support. Free speech may give you the right to voice your opinion but it also gives the members of this forum the right to criticize them. Make sure my friend that you understand all aspects of being a contributor here.

[PhiliptheUniterchaeronea]

Pankration, is correct once again.

I also want to say something else. Lets not take it upon us to insult Mr. Harper. We may not agree with him, and we know without a doubt this decision was wrong. However, I do not agree that we (including me) should question his integrity. He is a person and Prime Minister of Canada and we should respect that. As our former Prime Minister - late and perhaps greatest, I may add - Pierre Elliot Trudeau taught, we can disagree with the politics, but still respect the person. He has made a terrible error, but do not dehumanize the man. I don't care if the Macedonians and rest of the Greeks are angry, we have to be people of integrity. If you disagree, that is your business, but I will take action if we are awful people and how we express ourselves. Thanks.