Propaganda from Official Fyromian sites

[akritas]

Hellenes in this thread we must seeking for official FYROMian web sides that has a aim the stealing of our Greek history.
I start with the FYROMian Embassy in UK.

http://www.macedonianembassy.org.uk/history.html

mention as about the supposing FYROMian history.
I start with the ancient Macedonian history.!!


Macedonia is a historical region that originates from the ancient period. The zenith of the Macedonian kingdom, its unity, independence and predominance – political, military and economic – reached its apogee in the 4th century BC when the famous Philip II ( – 336 B.C.) and Alexander III(356 - 323 B.C.) ruled the prestigious Kingdom of Macedonia the Great.As you see the Skopjans start clevearly to say for region but finally they finish with the usual quotes as about the ancient Macedonians rulers
More information in
http://www.macedoniaontheweb.com/forum/ancient-macedonian-history/647-kings-macedon-their-reigns.html
After the dissolution of the Empire, the territory of Macedonia fell first under Roman and later under Byzantine rule. In the course of several centuries, the ancient Macedonians mixed with other ethnic groups such as Roman colonists.

In this part of course the all modern historians, even and those that disputed as about the initial origin like Borza and Badian, agree for the Hellenization of the Macedonians we don't see not one quote as about this.Maybe in few years we see (if we stop to fight them) that Filips V and others Macedonian kings fought only for the freedom of Slavonic tribes!!:p

More as about the Hellenistic period in
http://www.macedoniaontheweb.com/forum/ancient-macedonian-history/880-hellenistic-world-alexander.html
The penetration of Slavic tribes towards the Balkans ended at the beginning of the seventh century and created a new situation – Macedonia’s population mixed with the Slav newcomers but retained the Macedonian name, traditions and culture. At the beginning of this period the Macedonians were organized independently in their own tribal communities (sklavinas). Later, they fell under Byzantine and Bulgarian rule, alternatively.Apo pou na arxiso kai pou na telioso:laugh:
In this version as about the origin of this Slavonic nation the mixing theory and include Slavs-Romans-Macedonians and finally we have as usual agiain the FYROmian version of Macedonians:wacko: .Of course not of word as about the Proto-bulgarians ancestors of them.
Of course we read for first time that the Skopjans created the Sklavinie, a tottaly Byzantine term.Theirs propaganda is now in the cycle of the idiocity.Is good for those that know some kind of history(like me) but there are others that sliping in theirs fake historical boundaries
More informations in
http://www.macedoniaontheweb.com/forum/medieval-macedonian-history/173-slavic-settlements-macedonia.html
http://www.macedoniaontheweb.com/forum/skopjian-slavic-history-slavic-migration/211-sklaveniai.html
http://www.macedoniaontheweb.com/forum/skopjian-slavic-history-slavic-migration/406-slavic-settlement-greece-light-archaeological-sources-excellent.html
http://www.macedoniaontheweb.com/forum/skopjian-slavic-history-slavic-migration/449-ethnic-historical-origins-skopjian-nation.html





The history of the ancient Macedonian kingdom begins with Caranus, who was the first known Macedonian King (808-778 BC). By the 5th century BC the Macedonians expanded and forged a unified kingdom under Alexander I (498-454 B.C.) Also known as Alexander the Great.



In the final paragraph we have a repeat as about the ancient Macedonian history.Of course we don't read any words for the ancient writers that spoke for the Greekness of the Macedonians.
More as about this in
http://www.macedoniaontheweb.com/forum/ancient-macedonian-history/355-macedonian-royal-houses.html
http://www.macedoniaontheweb.com/forum/ancient-macedonian-history/857-modern-historians-about-macedonian-royal-house.html
http://www.macedoniaontheweb.com/forum/ancient-macedonian-history/433-caranos-pheidonas.html

[akritas]

Continuing to exposing the Skopjan propaganda by official sourses we just read the same history summary from FYROMIan embassy in Australia!!

http://www.macedonianemb.org.au/index_about.html#BRIEFHISTORICALSUMMARY


However, in 1912 and 1913 three Balkan states - Bulgaria, Serbia and Greece, waged the Balkan wars intending to conquer and divide Macedonia between them. The Balkan Wars between Greece, Bulgaria and Serbia ended with the treaty of Bucharest in 1913, with which, in spite of the protests of the ethnic Macedonians, Macedonia was divided into three parts.
We can read for one more time the nationalistic argyment as about the supposing lMacedonian division of the Slavonic origin and Bulgarian speakers Macedonian inhibants.
As a result, on 11 October 1941 in the Vardar part of Macedonia there was simultaneous uprising against the fascist occupation in Prilep and Kumanovo, where as in 1942 there were uprisings in the Aegean part of Macedonia (in Lerin and Kostur) headed by Lazo TrpovskiHere we have a new Uprising!! How many uprising had done this people!!:laugh:
I focus in the name.
Lazarus Trpovski
Who is tha guy?
Was a person that liberated from the Bulgarians faschists in 30 June 1941.Jailed because was communist with Greeks and others in the Akronauplia jail. In the speacefic date him and 26 other Slavmacedonian and Rominized Vlachs released from the Germans just decalared Bulgarian nationality. :laugh:
As about the date for sure is that we talk a pre=SNOF date(Nov 1943) and Ohrana era.
Your conclusions are yours:)

[akritas]

Enjoy how the FYROMian officials respect this "supposing Interim aggrement" and the VERGINA FLAG

Gotse Delchev Night 2002 from UM in Canada.

Foreign Minister Slobodan Casule

http://img238.imageshack.us/img238/1744/fyromianspmwithverginafgc8.jpg

[Titus]

How about this extract from a speech of FYROM's president Branko Crvenkovski to the FYROM parliament on 26th December 2006?

Dear Members of the Assembly,

The concern with the status and rights of the Macedonian national minority in the neighboring countries is our inherent right and obligation.

We insist on consistent application of European norms and standards in observing fundamental human rights and freedoms, among which the right to foster one’s national, cultural and linguistic identity.

The Republic of Macedonia has already proven its readiness to implement solutions in this context that go beyond even the highest international standards.

After all, countries already fully-fledged members of the European Union or countries that are firmly determined to become EU members in the forthcoming period are obliged to apply such an approach and they are obliged to honor their obligations.

Furthermore, this will be another important contribution to strengthening the bilateral relations, confirming the determination to share common European values.

Retrieved from www president.gov.mk/info_e.asp?SectionID=5&InfoID=2307

He doesn't name Greece or Bulgaria directly, but he does speak of "Macedonian minorities" in "neighboring countries" which are "countries already fully-fledged members of the European Union or countries that are firmly determined to become EU members".

[akritas]

Titus in this forum (anti-Greek Macedonia Propaganda) we need only official sourse from the web or scanning pictures that proove our claims and not conclusions.:)

[Flipper]

What are we waiting for? We should message the Greek Embassy and any other authority. :dry:

[akritas]

As you see the FYROMian nationalist propganda goes further.In n#2 post and 5 Oct 2006 the official FYROMian websites quoted for the Balkan wars

However, in 1912 and 1913 three Balkan states - Bulgaria, Serbia and Greece, waged the Balkan wars intending to conquer and divide Macedonia between them. The Balkan Wars between Greece, Bulgaria and Serbia ended with the treaty of Bucharest in 1913, with which, in spite of the protests of the ethnic Macedonians, Macedonia was divided into three parts.

Noe we have nationalistic escalation.
Now focus in the Land

http://img391.imageshack.us/img391/1686/fyromofficialpropagandabl0.jpg

Macedonian Embassy London (http://www.macedonianembassy.org.uk/history.html)

And still we talk for Interim Aggrement :mad:

[Tsontos]

Magazine "Defence", no.63, July 2001 (http://www.morm.gov.mk/2001/odbrana/odb63e.htm)

Roots (4)
Weapons and military skill in Macedonia through history
Alexander The Great – The Most Talented Strategist In The History Of Mankind
Written by: D-r Vance Stojcev


Many of the military leaders later admired and learned from the Alexander’s genius strategic movements and solutions, but he remained one of a kind, the greatest of the military warriors the mankind has ever seen

The Macedonian army armed itself with the existing weapons that were already known. Weaponry was reinforced after the reforms of Phillip II. Old weapons were improved and new types were produced. The most famous weapon workshops were the crafts centers in the city of Gortinia (Vardarski Rid) and in Hallkidikki. These workshops were places where many iron spears, arrows, knifes, swords, helmets, shields were made. In the time of Philip II and Alexander the Great, there was a production of many weapons that were Macedonian discoveries: long spears – saris, short swords – the famous cross-like iron sword – ksiphos, which was 50-60 cm long with a double cutting edge, as well as the curved one-edged sword, armors, bullet-proof vests, lower-leg and elbow protection and protection for horses. Macedonian army, according to the branches and services, was armed by unified weapons. Light infantry had bows and arrows and other types of light weapons. The heavy and light cavalry were armed with short spears, short swords, war axes, helmets, armors, war cars, war elephants etc. Engineering units were equipped with torso catapults, leaders, stone throwing devices, flammable materials and other tools.

Saris – the Symbol of the Macedonian superiority and invincibility

Saris was a specific, Macedonian weapon discovered by Phillip II. The Phalanx and the saris were the reason for the Macedonian superiority and invincibility. The Macedonian army was very much depending on the saris and its efficiency. The frightening action of the Macedonian phalanx, armed by saris and in co-action with the frightening Friendly cavalry created chaos in the enemy’s army. The saris was designed as 8 m long (24 feet or 7,34 m), but due to practical reasons, it was shortened down to 6,4 m (or 21 foot). Saris was made of three metal parts: leaf-like tip with a body, a link and an iron handle – the end of the spear.

The Macedonian phalanges, when in offense, used both of his hands to hold the spear that was 4,5 meters long in front of his body. The Macedonian phalanx mainly lined up itself in 16 rows, having 1 meter distance between the soldiers, which means that the first four rows could have stretched their saris in combat while the remaining rows moved with their spears held upwards. Such an image of the Macedonian phalanx in movement, with strictly defined lines, brigades and companies, and yet, lined up with their spears upwards and downwards, created the impression that it could defeat anything in front of itself. Previous practices of the formation of oblique line and in co-action with the heavy cavalry made the Macedonian army invincible. Besides, Macedonia became one of the biggest producers of weapons and military equipment.

Beside the weapons, the military equipment of the Macedonian army was also different from the rest of the ancient ethnic groups. The helmet was made from iron having an egg-like shape. There was a tip on the helmet which symbolized an eagle or a hawk when attacking.

Macedonian kings had a specifically developed signal system, with flags which marked the beginning of the battle or the attack of a certain military formation. There were several flags in different colors in the main headquarters. There was a flag made of red canvas attached to the tip of the spear and the rising of the flag marked the beginning of the combat. Military formations’ flags were in different colors. Each of the military formations had its own flag in the main headquarters. The rise of that flag marked the beginning of the attack by certain military unit.

Macedonia in the time of Alexander the Great

Macedonia is the oldest state in Europe. It was founded in 825 bc. when Karan was declared to be the first Macedonian king disregarding the previous ones since there are only mythological stories about them. Athens was founded in 776 and Rome in 753 bc. Alexander was born 500 years after it was founded. The oldest state got its most famous son.

[Truth Bearer]

What a load of rubbish Athens was founded well before1000 B.C how on earth did that stupid south western bulgar get his historical lies from????

[Truth Bearer]

The Acropolis of Athens was inhabited from Neolithic times. By 1400 BC Athens had become a powerful center of the Mycenaean civilization. Unlike other Mycenaean centers, such as Mycenae and Pylos, Athens was not sacked and abandoned at the time of the Doric invasion of about 1200 BC, and the Athenians always maintained that they were "pure" Ionians with no Doric element. However, Athens lost most of its power and probably dwindled to a small hill fortress once again.

By the 8th century BC Athens had re-emerged, by virtue of its central location in the Greek world, its secure stronghold on the Acropolis and its access to the sea, which gave it a natural advantage over potential rivals such as Thebes and Sparta. From early in the 1st millennium, Athens was a sovereign city-state, ruled at first by kings (see Kings of Athens). The kings stood at the head of a land-owning aristocracy known as the Eupatridae (the "well-born"), whose instrument of government was a Council which met on the Hill of Ares, called the Areopagus. This body appointed the chief city officials, the archons and the polemarch (commander-in-chief).

Before the concept of the political state arose, four tribes based upon family relationships dominated the area. The members had certain rights, privileges, and obligations:

History of Athens - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Athens)

[pankration]

Enjoy how the FYROMian officials respect this "supposing Interim aggrement" and the VERGINA FLAG

Gotse Delchev Night 2002 from UM in Canada.

Foreign Minister Slobodan Casule

http://img238.imageshack.us/img238/1744/fyromianspmwithverginafgc8.jpg

:wiggle::wiggle::wiggle::wiggle: Looks like a GREEK dance to me!:clapping:

[Istor]

For the first time, I think, the Greek FM says that FYROM does violate interim agremment: Statement of Foreign Ministry spokesman Mr. G. Koumoutsakos regarding today’s statements from FYROM President Mr. Crvenkovski (http://www.ypex.gov.gr/www.mfa.gr/Articles/el-GR/040607_McC1305.htm)

This is all provided for in the Interim Agreement, which the current Skopje government is unfortunately calling in to question through many of its actions

[akritas]

FYROMacedonian PM Gruevski with the Vergina Flag behind of him.

And we talk for ...agreement

http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/181/gruevskiverginaye3.jpg

[akritas]

Below are two maps that publish in FYROMacedonian schools and show the Imperialist view of this State.

In the first map (8th Grade,2005, page 54) you can see in the Yellow line the ethnotical borders as they imagine the FYROMacedonian nationalists and this include of course the Greek Macedonia(Green part)


http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/1601/schoolbook7thgrade2005kt1.jpg


In the second map (7th Grade, 2005, page 120) you can see the geographical-ethnotiical borders as they imagine the FYROMacedonian nationalists

http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/3756/schoolbook8thgrade2005vk6.jpg

source
Ã�ëõôñùôéêüò Éìðåñéáëéóìüò ÓêïðßùÃ* (http://www.ems.name/Alitrotikos_Imperialismos.htm)

[akritas]

4 more documents that show the FYROMacedonian interetism. Is a survey that given in schools and show for one more time the nationalists views of them.

http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/545/question9jd6.th.jpg (http://img521.imageshack.us/my.php?image=question9jd6.jpg)

http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/7186/question10mt6.th.jpg (http://img521.imageshack.us/my.php?image=question10mt6.jpg)

http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/2007/question11qw9.th.jpg (http://img521.imageshack.us/my.php?image=question11qw9.jpg)


http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/5581/question12de7.th.jpg (http://img521.imageshack.us/my.php?image=question12de7.jpg)

Vasiliye can you translate the detected quotes ?

[Vasiliye]

http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/545/question9jd6.th.jpg (http://img521.imageshack.us/my.php?image=question9jd6.jpg)
(The pupil) should analyze the politics of conquest of the Balkan states towards Macedonia, their partnership and hostility during both Balkan wars and consequences of these wars for Macedonian and the Macedonian people
-----------------------------
http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/7186/question10mt6.th.jpg (http://img521.imageshack.us/my.php?image=question10mt6.jpg)
(The pupil) should describe the condition of the Macedonian people under the occupations and participations of Macedonians in different armies.
-----------------------------
http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/2007/question11qw9.th.jpg (http://img521.imageshack.us/my.php?image=question11qw9.jpg)
(The pupil)should compare the situation of the Macedonian people under the governments of different Balkan regimes.To analyze the policy of denationalisation and assimilation.To explain the ethnic changes.To know about the organizations and different fractions within the Macedonian liberation movement during both World wars.To explain the efforts of Macedonian organizations, societies and individuals in affirmation of Macedonian national consciousness, language and culture.
------------------------------

http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/5581/question12de7.th.jpg (http://img521.imageshack.us/my.php?image=question12de7.jpg)
(The pupil) should describe the Civil war in Greece, its consequences and political development in Greece until the end of XX century.

To analyze the position of the Macedonians in neighbouring countries and makes a comparison with the position of ethnic communities in the RM
------------------------------

[akritas]

Μια πρωτοφανή προβοκάτσια σε βάρος της Ελλάδας έστησε η σκοπιανή ηγεσία με τις ευλογίες του ΝΑΤΟ, επιχειρώντας να δημιουργήσει τετελεσμένα και να καθιερώσει ατύπως στο εσωτερικό της Συμμαχίας τη συνταγματική ονομασία της «Δημοκρατία της Μακεδονίας».

Με το λογότυπο μάλιστα του ΝΑΤΟ προβάλλονται για πρώτη φορά όλοι οι ανιστόρητοι ισχυρισμοί των Σκοπίων περί Μεγάλου Αλεξάνδρου και οι αλυτρωτικές αναφορές σε «Μακεδονία του Αιγαίου», που δεν μπόρεσε να... απελευθερωθεί...

Στις 28-29 Ιουνίου συνέρχεται στην Οχρίδα η υπουργική συνάντηση του Συμβουλίου Ευρωατλαντικής Συνεργασίας - Φόρουμ Ασφαλείας (Euro Atlantic Partnership Council - Security Forum), ένα από τα σημαντικά όργανα του ΝΑΤΟ, καθώς φέρνει στο ίδιο τραπέζι τα 26 κράτη-μέλη της συμμαχίας με τις 23 χώρες που διατηρούν σχέση συνεργασίας και έχουν καθεστώς εταίρου με τη Συμμαχία.

Από την πρώτη στιγμή είχε επισημανθεί ότι η επιλογή της ΠΓΔΜ για τη διοργάνωση αυτής της σημαντικής συνάντησης θα εμφάνιζε σοβαρά προβλήματα, καθώς αυτή η χώρα θα διοργάνωνε ως «Δημοκρατία της Μακεδονίας» την εκδήλωση ενός διεθνούς οργανισμού στον οποίο έχει υποβάλει αίτηση ένταξης, ενώ εκκρεμεί ακόμη το θέμα της ονομασίας με το οποίο θα γίνει δεκτή.

Αποδέχονται
Ετσι για πρώτη φορά στην ιστορία του Σκοπιανού, το επίσημο ΝΑΤΟ αποδέχεται τη χρήση της συνταγματικής ονομασίας «Δημοκρατία της Μακεδονίας», φέρνοντας σε ιδιαίτερα δύσκολη θέση την ελληνική κυβέρνηση.
Στην επίσημη ιστοσελίδα της Συμμαχίας (North Atlantic Treaty Organisation - Official Homepage (http://www.NATO.int)), όπου αναγγέλλεται η σημαντική συνάντηση της Οχρίδας, η παραπομπή στη φιλοξενούσα χώρα οδηγεί στην ειδική ιστοσελίδα που έστησαν τα Σκόπια (EAPC Security Forum (http://www.eapc-ohrid.gov.mk)), όπου όχι μόνο προβάλλεται κάτω από το λογότυπο του ΝΑΤΟ το συνταγματικό όνομα «Μακεδονία», αλλά προβάλλεται όλο το φάσμα των αλυτρωτικών διεκδικήσεων εναντίον της χώρας μας.
Ετσι με την ανοχή του ΝΑΤΟ προσφέρεται μια πρωτοφανής ευκαιρία στη σκοπιανή πλευρά να προβάλλει τις θέσεις της (οι οποίες παραβιάζουν συμφωνίες και βρίσκονται σε πλήρη αντίθεση με τα συμφέροντα της Ελλάδας που είναι ήδη κράτος-μέλος), καθώς όλες οι ξένες αντιπροσωπείες και οι ξένοι δημοσιογράφοι είναι υποχρεωμένοι να επισκεφθούν αυτήν την ιστοσελίδα, προκειμένου να ενημερωθούν για τις λεπτομέρειες της διοργάνωσης (ξενοδοχεία, ατζέντα, πρόγραμμα συνεδριάσεων και οπτικοακουστικό υλικό), ενώ αποδέκτες της σκοπιανής προπαγάνδας είναι και οι χιλιάδες αν όχι εκατομμύρια επισκέπτες της ιστοσελίδας του ΝΑΤΟ, από όλο τον κόσμο.
Καθώς πουθενά δεν γίνεται αναφορά στο όνομα FYROM, δημιουργούνται λανθασμένες εντυπώσεις στη διεθνή κοινή γνώμη και με τη σιωπηρή αποδοχή του ονόματος «Δημοκρατία της Μακεδονίας» στο πλαίσιο του ΝΑΤΟ αποδυναμώνεται διπλωματικά η χώρα μας στην προσπάθειά της για εξεύρεση αμοιβαία αποδεκτής λύσης.

MIA IΣΤΟΡΙΑ ΠΕΡΙΒΟΛΙ

Αλυτρωτικές αναφορές στη «Μακεδονία του Αιγαίου»

Στην ιστοσελίδα παρουσιάζεται η ιστορία της φιλοξενούσας χώρας, όπου αναφέρεται ότι το «Βασίλειο της Μακεδονίας έφτασε στο ζενίθ του τον 4ο π.χ. αιώνα με τον Φίλιππο Β και τον Αλέξανδρο Γ, που έμεινε στην ιστορία ως «Αλέξανδρος ο Μέγας».

Φτάνοντας στον 20ό αιώνα, η σύντομη ιστορία της χώρας παρουσιάζεται ως εξής:
«Το 1912 και 1913 τρία βαλκανικά κράτη, Βουλγαρία, Σερβία και Ελλάδα, ενεπλάκησαν στους Βαλκανικούς πολέμους με σκοπό να καταλάβουν και να μοιράσουν μεταξύ τους τη Μακεδονία. Οι Βαλκανικοί πόλεμοι τελείωσαν με τη συνθήκη του Βουκουρεστίου το 1913, με την οποία, παρά τις διαμαρτυρίες των εθνικά μακεδόνων, η Μακεδονία διαμελίστηκε σε τρία τμήματα».
Φτάνοντας στον αντιναζιστικό αγώνα, η σκοπιανή προπαγάνδα τον εμφανίζει ως... απελευθερωτικό αγώνα των «Μακεδόνων».

«Στις 11 Οκτωβρίου 1941 στο τμήμα του Βαρδάρη της Μακεδονίας εκδηλώθηκε εξέγερση εναντίον της φασιστικής κατάληψης του Κουμανόβου και του Πρίλεπ, ενώ το 1942 εκδηλώθηκαν εξεγέρσεις και στο Αιγιακό τμήμα της Μακεδονίας (στο «Λέριν» και «Κοστούρ» - σ.σ.: η Φλώρινα και η Καστοριά) υπό την ηγεσία του Λάζο Τρπόφσκι και στο τμήμα του Πίριν της Μακεδονίας (στην Ντούπνιτσα) υπό την ηγεσία του Νικολά Παραπουνοφ.
«Παρ όλα αυτά, μόνο στο τμήμα του Βαρδάρη πέτυχαν να δημιουργήσουν ένα κράτος στο όνομα της Δημοκρατίας της Μακεδονίας, στο πλαίσιο της Ομοσπονδιακής Δημοκρατίας της Γιουγκοσλαβίας. Οι Μακεδόνες στο Πίριν κέρδισαν αυτονομία, τα πολιτιστικά και εθνικά δικαιώματά τους το 1946, τα οποία όμως ανακλήθηκαν στο τέλος της δεκαετίας στη σκιά του Ψυχρού Πολέμου.

Στο Αιγιακό κομμάτι της Μακεδονίας υπήρξε εμφύλιος πόλεμος, στον οποίο οι Μακεδόνες πήραν μέρος ελπίζοντας να αποκτήσουν τα εθνικά και πολιτιστικά δικαιώματά τους, παρ όλα αυτά, όμως, με το τέλος του εμφύλιου πόλεμου εκατοντάδες χιλιάδες Μακεδόνες εξορίστηκαν και απαγορεύτηκε κάθε στοιχείο εθνικής μακεδονικής ταυτότητας...».

ethnos.gr - ÓêïðéáÃ*Þ ðñïðáãÜÃ*äá ìå óôÞñéîç áðü ôï Ã�Ã�ÔÃ� - ðïëéôéêç (http://www.ethnos.gr/article.asp?catid=5347&subid=2&pubid=116604)

EAPC Security Forum (http://www.eapc-ohrid.gov.mk/default.aspx?id=20)

http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/1157/eapcnatohistory1ra2.th.jpg (http://img159.imageshack.us/my.php?image=eapcnatohistory1ra2.jpg)http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/8594/eapcnatohistory2qs8.th.jpg (http://img159.imageshack.us/my.php?image=eapcnatohistory2qs8.jpg)

[Amarantos]

http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/5778/731012bhf1.jpg
Nikola Gruevski, Prime Minister of Fyrom.

[FilipposTheGreat]

ΚΑΛΑ..και μετα αν δεν ασκησουν βετο, ειναι ΟΛΟΙ οι πολιτικοι προδοτες!!!ΒΕΤΟ εδω και τωρα!! Ολα αυτα ειναι αιτια πολεμου.. Casus belli !! :mad:

MACEDONIA is ONE and HELLENIC!!

Μου αρεσει που εχουμε κατοχυρωσει τον ηλιο της βεργινας, και το κομμα της κυβερνησης των Σκοπιων χρησιμοποιει κανονικα τον ηλιο!! ΕΛΕΟΣ!!

Ενας πολιτικος με @@@@ δε μπορει να υπαρξει στην Ελλαδα??
Με αυτα που βλεπω, ολο και περισσοτερο δε θελω συμβιβασμο με αυτα τα ζωα!!

'Η αλλαζουν ονομα εδω και τωρα ή πολεμος εδω και τωρα!!Δε παει αλλο!!
Αρχιζουμε με ΒΕΤΟ και μετα πολεμος!! Μια-δυο μερες υποθεση ειναι!!

[akritas]

amarante where this pic come from ?

[Amarantos]

Φαινεται οτι ο μακεδονας πρωθυπουργος (τον κωστακη εννοω μην μπερδευτει κιολλας και νομιζει οτι μιλαμε για κανεναν αλλον :laugh:) μαζι με ολο το συναπαντημα, αν και ειχε την ευκαιρια να δει την συγκεκριμενη φωτογραφια στον πασιγνωστο ιστοτοπο του in.gr την 16/08/06, ηταν απασχολημενος με κατι σοβαροτερο και του διεφυγε.

news in.gr - Ç áìïéâáßá ëýóç äåÃ* èá áðåéëåß ôï óõÃ*ôáãìáôéêü üÃ*ïìá ôçò Ã�ÃÄÌ, äÞëùóå ï Ã�.Ãêñïýåöóêé (http://www.in.gr/news/article.asp?lngEntityID=731012)

Υσ. δεκαπενταυγουστος ρε σεις, τα μπανια του λαου, καυσωνας....

[akritas]

The political Part “Macedonian Alliance” with president the Dzordzi (George) Atanasovski in clear violation of Article 7 of the Interim Accord is a registered political party with the FYROM.

Look what they mention in theira Statute


MACEDONIAN ALLIANCE


In accordance with Article 20. paragraph 1 and 2 of the Constitution of Republic of Macedonia and Article 9 of the law for political parties, the Inaugural meeting of Macedonian Alliance on 14th Jan. 1996 established

STATUTE OF THE MACEDONIAN ALLIANCE


1. GENERAL REGULATIONS

Article 1
This Statute defines the following :

--------------------------------------------------------------


Article 6
The Alliance has a flag and coat of arms.
The flag of the Alliance is red and in the middle there is a golden yellow sun with a blue flower.
The rate between width and length of the flag is two to three.
The coat of arms is a shield with red part. In the middle of the shield there is a golden yellow sun with a blue flower.



MACEDONIAN ALLIANCE (http://www.makedonskosonce.com/Alijansa/indexEN.htm)


The 55 years old Gjorgjija George Atanasoski was president and is the founder of the North American All-Slav Macedonian Congress. In the past (1994) he tried to become president of FYROM.

MACEDONIAN ALLIANCE (http://www.makedonskosonce.com/Alijansa/indexEN.htm)

below is the president Gjorgjija George Atanasoski with the Vergina symbol in the MAC flag


http://www.makedonskosonce.com/Alijansa/George01.jpg

"Macedonian" Allience is the sponsor of the Statues of Great Alexander in FYROM.

[Truth Bearer]

I'm telling you it's the fyromians from the diaspora that are bankrolling all this pan fyromian natioanlistic stuff Akritas......

[Tsontos]

The Skops used the excuse of the Ohrid Security forum to make a history page with all the usual FYROM nationalist historical narrative found on it: EAPC Security Forum (http://www.eapc-ohrid.gov.mk/default.aspx?id=20)

[Astoria]

out of curiousity, has any sent this to greek authorities? (concerning the propoganda from mak embassy in UK)

[Tsontos]

Greek authorities couldnt give a stuff. Pretty hard for them not to know about the official use of Vergina by FYROM munipalities and the various other crap in this thread.

[Draco]

http://www.mfa.gov.mk//default1.aspx?ItemID=291

Read the whole damn thing! The propaganda in this quote says it all
In the period from 969 until 1018, a vast empire of the Macedonians emerged, second empire of the Macedonians after the empire of Alexander the Great, the Empire of King Samuel with its capital in Ohrid.Arguably however this is yet another gift for Greece, grounds to veto (it is a violation of the Interim Agreement or pretty close, isn't it?). Unless of course FYROM is planning on using this as another bargaining chip (like the flag).

[akritas]

"Macedonia's history" according to FYROM's YPEX (http://www.mfa.gov.mk//default1.aspx?ItemID=291)

Read the whole damn thing! The propaganda in this quote says it all

Arguably however this is yet another gift for Greece, grounds to veto (it is a violation of the Interim Agreement or pretty close, isn't it?). Unless of course FYROM is planning on using this as another bargaining chip (like the flag).
How the Byzantine history falsificated ?

The penetration of Slavic tribes towards the Balkans ended at the beginning of the seventh century and created a new situation - Macedonia's population mixed with the Slav newcomers but retained the Macedonian name, traditions and culture.At the beginning of this period the Macedonians were organized independently in their own tribal communities (sklavinas). Later, they fell under Byzantine and Bulgarian rule, alternatively.

And of course in the below quote

The Krushevo Republic was declared, the first Republic on the Balkans with a President and Parliament with representatives of all ethnic communities.

The Parliament didnt have "ethnic Macedonian" representatiives. As also the flag was ....

http://www.fotw.us/images/m/mk!1913.gif

a common Bulgarian historical flag.

[Draco]

How the Byzantine history falsificated ?

The penetration of Slavic tribes towards the Balkans ended at the beginning of the seventh century and created a new situation - Macedonia's population mixed with the Slav newcomers but retained the Macedonian name, traditions and culture.At the beginning of this period the Macedonians were organized independently in their own tribal communities (sklavinas). Later, they fell under Byzantine and Bulgarian rule, alternatively.
When this is added in the context of their official ideology (that Ancient Macedonians were an independent Indo-European people who were absorbed by the Slavs when they arrived in the ~7th century) it is propagandistic.
And of course in the below quote

The Krushevo Republic was declared, the first Republic on the Balkans with a President and Parliament with representatives of all ethnic communities.

The Parliament didnt have "ethnic Macedonian" representatiives.
I think the views of the authors of that text are pretty clear, they just slipped up (forgot that its parliament didn't have "ethnic Macedonians").

[Xiotis]

This comes from the website of:

"The Embassy of the Republic of Macedonia in Canberra, Australia"

http://www.macedonianemb.org.au/index_about.html

I draw your attention to the mythical historiography which implies a "Macedonian nation" existed during biblical times:


This is an apt moment to ask the question: Why did Paul the Apostle come to preach the new idea first in Macedonia and not in some other European country? How shall we explain this fact? What was it that attracted the attention of this apostle? There can only be one explanation: Paul the Apostle was a brilliant man who knew very well that in order to spread his gospel successfully he should win over to his side a renowned and dignified nation, equal to the Romans in the strength of its spirit. In those ancient times Macedonia was such a nation. To deny the existence of Macedonia and the Macedonians means to deny the truthfulness of the Bible, and the work and the epistles of the greatest among the apostles, Paul. Everybody knows that Paul the Apostle preached among the Macedonians, established church communities in Macedonia, sent epistles to the Macedonians in Philippi and Thessalonica, which have endured as an integral part of the Bible, read daily by cultured Christian people.And I draw to your attention the theory that slavs mixed with the original Macedonians to form the modern "Macedonian ethnicity":


The penetration of Slavic tribes towards the Balkans ended at the beginning of the seventh century and created a new situation - Macedonia's population mixed with the Slav newcomers but retained the Macedonian name, traditions and cultureI wonder what sources they base this mythology on? The scholars they quote ad infinitum all over their nationalist websites, Badian and Borza, tell them that the Macedonians were at the very least fully Hellenized by the Hellenistic era.

These people are getting more and more delusional by the day!

[olvios]

Sources in Christianity,Islam and judaism attest to the fact that macedons were Greeks.The skopians are lying in an idiotic and blasphemous fashion as always.

[Paulos Melas]

"Macedonia is a historical region that originates from the ancient period. The history of the ancient Macedonian kingdom begins with Caranus, who was the first known Macedonian King (808-778 BC). By the 5th century BC the Macedonians expanded and forged a unified kingdom under Alexander I (498-454 B.C.) The zenith of the Macedonian kingdom, its unity, independence and predominance - political, military and economic - reached its apogee in the 4th century BC when the famous Philip II (- 336 B.C.) and Alexander III (356 - 323 B.C.) ruled the prestigious Kingdom of Macedonia the Great. Alexander III is also known as Alexander the Great.

After the dissolution of the Empire, the territory of Macedonia fell first under Roman and later under Byzantine rule. In the course of several centuries, the ancient Macedonians mixed with other ethnic groups such as Roman colonists.

The penetration of Slavic tribes towards the Balkans ended at the beginning of the seventh century and created a new situation - Macedonia's population mixed with the Slav newcomers but retained the Macedonian name, traditions and culture. At the beginning of this period the Macedonians were organized independently in their own tribal communities (sklavinas). Later, they fell under Byzantine and Bulgarian rule, alternatively."

http://www.mfa.gov.mk/default1.aspx?ItemID=291

[Paulos Melas]

And from the same site their irridentic claims:

Organized in TMORO - Secret Macedonian - Odrin Revolutionary Organization, which was formed in 1893 in Thessalonica (current day Greece).
The greatest uprising in Macedonian history occurred on August 2, 1903, on St. Elias’s Day, when Macedonian revolutionaries organized the Macedonians and the entire population to a rebellion against Ottoman rule. Large parts of Macedonia were liberated. The largest free territory was the town of Krushevo and the territory around it. The Krushevo Republic was declared, the first Republic on the Balkans with a President and Parliament with representatives of all ethnic communities. However, the Republic existed only 10 days, because the Ottoman Empire sent a large army that crushed the uprising and put an end to the Republic and demolished the town and the surrounding villages.

Even after the destruction of the Republic, the Macedonians continued to resist, and the Ottoman rule weakened. Famous leaders for Macedonian liberation and independence were Karposh, Goce Delchev, Jane Sandanski, Nikola Karev, Damjan Gruev, Pitu Guli, Lazo Trpovski, Nikola Parapunov, Dimitar Pop-Gjorgjiev, Nikola Petrov-Rusinski and others.

Macedonian soldiers headed by Jane Sandanski from the organization VMRO took part in the revolution of the Young Turks began in 1908 (Vinica Uprising). After the revolution, the Ottoman Empire was taken over by the Young Turks (one of their leaders was Mustafa Kemal Attaturk who managed to establish the Republic of Turkey after the First World War). The newly formed Parliament of Turkey included in its composition two Macedonians as representatives of Macedonia. In this period, Macedonia was granted the right to national Macedonian self organizing, more precisely autonomy.

However, in 1912 and 1913 three Balkan states - Bulgaria, Serbia and Greece, waged the Balkan wars intending to conquer and divide Macedonia between them. The Balkan Wars between Greece, Bulgaria and Serbia ended with the treaty of Bucharest in 1913, with which, in spite of the protests of the ethnic Macedonians, Macedonia was divided into three parts. The Great Powers had no interest in the voice of the Macedonian - the dismemberment of Macedonia had already been accomplished, and no power seriously endorsed revision of the partition. Accordingly, Greece maintained its lion's share of Macedonian territory: 35.169 square kilometres; the Kingdom of the Serbs, Croats and Slovenes retained 25.774 square kilometres; and Bulgaria was allowed to take, after minor revision, 6.798 square kilometres.

During World War II (1941-1945), Macedonians took part in the anti-fascist coalition for creating their own state Macedonia, respecting the promise from the Atlantic charter that all nations who take part in the struggle against fascism shall choose their own form of government and shall be afforded "the means of dwelling in safety within their own boundaries, and which will afford assurance that all the men in all lands may live out their lives in freedom from fear and want".


As a result, on 11 October 1941 in the Vardar part of Macedonia there was simultaneous uprising against the fascist occupation in Prilep and Kumanovo, where as in 1942 there were uprisings in the Aegean part of Macedonia (in Lerin and Kostur) headed by Lazo Trpovski and in the Pirin part of Macedonia (in Dupnica) headed by Nikola Parapunov. In spite of the lack of coordination, the intention was clear - liberation of the entire territory of Macedonia. However, only the people in the Vardar part managed to create a state in the face of the People's Republic of Macedonia within the framework of then Federal People's Republic of Yugoslavia. The Macedonians in the Pirin part of Macedonia were granted autonomy and certain cultural and ethnic rights in 1946, but these rights were revoked at the end of the decade at the height of the cold war. In the Aegean part of Macedonia there was a civil war in which the Macedonians took part hoping to acquire certain ethnic and cultural right, however at the end of the civil war hundreds of thousands of Macedonians were exiled and any show of ethnic Macedonian identity was banned.
The Republic of Macedonia was proclaimed at the first session of the Antifascist Assembly for the People's Liberation of Macedonia (on St. Elias’s Day - August 2, 1944). Later, by the provisions of the first Constitution (December 31, 1946), it became a constitutive part of the Federal People's Republic of Yugoslavia.

The first multi-party elections for representatives in the Parliament of the Republic of Macedonia were held on November 11th, 1990, establishing parliamentary democracy in Macedonia.

In accordance with the Charter of the United Nations concerning self-determination and equal rights, the Assembly of the Republic of Macedonia adopted the Declaration for International Recognition of the Republic of Macedonia on September 17th, 1991, which confirmed the will of the citizens to live in a sovereign and independent state. According to the Constitution adopted November 17th, 1991, the Republic of Macedonia is a sovereign, independent, democratic and social state. April 8, 1993, Macedonia becomes a UN memb"

Is it moment for the greek armed forces to resolve the issue once and for all?

[Draco]

Don't worry Pavlo. This will be resolved when Greece vetos their proposed accession to NATO. FYROM will then ask Greece why, and Greece'll point to the Interim Accord and (amongst many many others) to that link.

[Demetrius Doukas]

Truth Bearer,
do you see clearly now that there is NO WAY FOR COMPROMISE with these guys???

[akritas]

Below are two maps that publish in FYROMacedonian schools and show the Imperialist view of this State.

http://img108.imageshack.us/img108/5381/pagesfromirredentaaegealz8.jpg



http://img236.imageshack.us/img236/1466/pagesfromirredentaaegeann3.jpg


source:
Macedonianism (http://www.ems.name/Makedonismos_english.htm)

[Ptolemy]

FYROM's 'State Audit Office' (http://www.dzr.gov.mk/EN/DesktopDefault.aspx?tabindex=0&tabid=278).

Look at the introduction of "Republic of Macedonia"

http://www.dzr.gov.mk/EN/Uploads/1,%20Mission,%20Introduction-Republic%20of%20Macedonia.pdf


The roots of the Macedonian state date back to the times of ancient Macedonia. The territory of Macedonia has witnessed many events and has been subject to many conquests throughout this period. The new history of Macedonia begins with the Krushevo Republic of August 1903 and creation of the Federal Republic in Macedonia of August 1944.

[Reaper]

Look at the fucking address of the building. <Marshall Tito...

Address:
State Audit Office
Marshal Tito 12/3
Palata Macedonia
1000 Skopje

[Victor]

Macedonias ethnic borders?THats funny since somewhere close to 99% of the fyromanians from Greece are from the Florina and Kastoria areas,and 0% are from the glorious capital of "Solun".
Liars!!!!!!!!!!!

[Victor]

Look at the fucking address of the building. <Marshall Tito...

Address:
State Audit Office
Marshal Tito 12/3
Palata Macedonia
1000 SkopjeEVEn though the diaspora idiots deny it,the local fyromanians love and adore Tito more than any part of YUgoslavia.

[Truth Bearer]

Of course they love him he fabricated their whole historical myth!!!

[akritas]

The weather forecast according Skopjan TV as broadcast every night in 20:30 Greek time.
You can see what they dream our Slav neigbours.

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/9316/skopjanforecastdf4.jpg

[Draco]

Akrita, that's outrageous! The Greek government should definitely mention this when FYROM's fulfillment of the "good neighborly" relations requirement for NATO membership is discussed.

[Draco]

Is that from a state TV station or a private one?

[Christov]

The weather forecast according Skopjan TV as broadcast every night in 20:30 Greek time.
You can see what they dream our Slav neigbours.

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/9316/skopjanforecastdf4.jpgC'mon, it's normal practise everyhere in the world to use names in the own language.

[Tsontos]

Christov do Bulgarian stations show the weather for all the cities of San Stefanska Bulgaria and nowhere else?

[Alexandros]

C'mon, it's normal practise everyhere in the world to use names in the own language.

Yes, i agree ... but not in Greater-FYROM-Radius ...



Alexandros

[akritas]

Christov 9 cities belong in Greece and only.....6 in FYROM. Is that a common practice ?
We must see the forest and not the tree. The specific map focus in Greater Macedonia as the Slav Macedonists dream always.

[Christov]

Christov 9 cities belong in Greece and only.....6 in FYROM. Is that a common practice ?
We must see the forest and not the tree. The specific map focus in Greater Macedonia as the Slav Macedonists dream always.Here is a video- link to the weather forecast of the Bulgarian National Television (http://news.bnt.bg/content/view/weather):

[akritas]

Here is a video- link to the weather forecast of the Bulgarian National Television (http://news.bnt.bg/content/view/weather):
So then I am right when I say that the FYROMian map is great example of irredentism. The video show maps of the Bulgaria, Balkans and Europe and not any other nationalist dreams.

[Victor]

Here is a video- link to the weather forecast of the Bulgarian National Television (http://news.bnt.bg/content/view/weather):
I wonder how she got her job.:)

[Christov]

I wonder how she got her job.:)Me too :clap2:

[akritas]

from

http://www.noiazomai.net/xartisnteltsef.html

Skopjan PM Gruevski and one photo....without any other comment, photo speaks its-self

http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/581/gruevskigreatfyrom2008mu0.jpg

http://img503.imageshack.us/img503/5639/gruevskigreatfyrom20081ll2.jpg

[Makedonia22]

Has this made it to the tv/newspapers in Greece?

[akritas]

Has this made it to the tv/newspapers in Greece?
No , the Greek media focus in Zaxopoulos, Siemens, New Archibishop and US elections!!!!
COMPLETELY SILENCE:angry:

[Makedonia22]

Send the pictures to the media then ;)

[Morphesau]

A complete disgrace :mad: by the Skopjians

[Truth Bearer]

Thieves and pillagers of Hellenic,Bulgarian and Serbian history

[Astoria]

http://arhiv.gov.mk/j_en/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=12&Itemid=26

Try not to laugh.

[Amarantos]

1.
http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/8392/skopev5.png

2.
http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/3469/skop2iw7.png


http://www.maticanaiselenici.com/en/

[kostas68]

According to the Fyromian ministry of information,Veria,Edessa,Kastoria and Serres were Slavic towns in 9th century:
In the second half of the 9th century there were already developed Slav towns which in the time of Samuil proved a substantial obstacle to the Byzantine army, including: Her (Veria), Voden (Edessa), Kostur (Kastoria), Pelagonia, Maleevo, Ohrid, Ostrovo, Polog, Prespa, Prilep, Ser (Seres), Skopje, Strumica, gtip and so on.
The text is from this website:
http://www.macedoniagiftshop.com/traditional_houses_in_macedonia_2.htm
In the bottom is written <Ministry of information of Republic of Macedonia>
Can the fyromian ministry of information explain us,why the hell are mentioned Greek cities in an article of its official website about the traditional houses and fortresses of FYROM?