The mongoloid origins of the turks

[Ionian Sword]

A brief summary of the early history of turkish tribes and their mongol origins. Turks go back to Siberia and Mongolia! Ekei ekei, pisw ws tin Kokkini Mhlia!!

The Turkic people originated from the northern branch of Mongoloid that initially inhabited around the lake Baikal in Siberia. Also based on scripts and excavations it is known to scientists today that one of the earliest known Turkic people, the Quanyi, lived in Ordos and Inner Mongolia. They shared ancestors with other Altaic people like Mongols and Tsungusic people. The Turks/Turkut/Tujue was originally pure mongoloids, like mongols.
After their conquest of Central Asia, they mixed with some White people who occupied oasys cities in the Tarim Basin at that time. After that they were more like Mongoloid still, but they were not pure Mongoloids either but still they kept the mongol spirit of their forefathers and still their language was mongol as most of their customs and uniforms also. Turkic peoples in general, incluiding the Tu Jue, the Ding Lin and Gui Fang and the rest of the Turanians as well were recorded from Chinese scripts of the time to have slanted eyes, long but not thick facial hair and lots of body hair (body hair was a feature they got after mixing with the few withes they conquered as body hair is something that pure mongols dont have).
The Tujue/Turku/Turuk/Turks were divided cause of their gerography location into two basic and very simmilar groups (each group consists also of many smaller groups of Turkish/Turanian tribes) : The Eastern turku (Dong Tujue) and the Western turuk (Xi Tujue). In the 7th century, during the time of Ishbara Khaghan, the Western turku was re-organised into ten tribes and were given the name On Okh ("Ten Arrows" meaning Ten Tribes, in the language of another turanian turkish tribe it means ten allies). This On Okh was divided into two groups: the Nushibi (West) and the Tolu ( East). The On Okh also incluided the Turgish and Pecheneg Turks, the Turgish later disappeared from history after 766 (they probably assimiliated into the Kharlukh Turks and later the Oghuz Turks). The Pechenegs migrated to Eastern Europe but they were massacred by the Khypchakh Turks in 1092 . The remaining Pechenegs melted in the European Oghuz and Khypchakh Turks.
The Eastern turku people became subjects of the Orkhun Uyghur Khaghanate (another Turkish/turanian tribe that united under its control the rest tribe at this time)also known as the Tokhuz Oghuz-On Uyghur Khaghanate. In 840, the fierce Khyrghiz (another turkish/turanian tribe) invaded Mongolia and destroyed the Uyghur Khaghanate; the Uyghurs migrated to Turfan and Kansu, where they founded two smaller khaghanates.
The Orkhun Uyghurs (composed of Ten Tribes) were living together with the Tokhuz Oghuz (Nine Tribes). However, in 840, when Mongolia fell in chaos, the turku disappeared, the Uyghurs scattered to two regions and the Tokhuz Oghuz were left alone. These Nine tribes migrated to Western Turkistan after 840 and settled on the plains north of the Aral Sea and Syr-Derya. There, the Nine Tribes mixed with some other turkish tribes who inluided Turkic and a few Iranic ramnents, some of the original tribes splitted and re-arraned to form new tribes; thus forming the OGHUZ TURKS (Uz/Uzoi in Greek, Tork/Torki in Russian, Ghuz in Arabic). During the 10th-11th centuries, these Oghuz were made up of 22 tribes (as a result of mixing and re-arrangements). During the 12th century (ot after the 1070s), they became 24 tribes.
The Oghuz had established a state north of the Aral-Syrderya. This state was destroyed by the newly-arrived Khypchak-Kuman Turks (who had broken from the main Kimek Turks in Sourthwestern Siberia; the Kimek were the descendants of the Chik people) in 1030; some of the Oghuz fled to the Pontic Steppes (where they were named as Torki by the Russians) and later migrated to Romania-Dobruja-Moldova. Most of the larger body of Oghuz gathered around Selchuck/Selchur/Salchukh Begh (son of Commander Dukhakh from the Khynykh tribe) and became Muslim; they first migrated to Transoxiana but they were expelled from there by the Khara-Khanid Turkish Dynasty. The Muslim Oghuz (called Turkman/Turkoman or Turkmen meaning "Muslim Turks") then fled to Khorasan-Turkmenistan. There, a small group of them broke and went to Iraq (who formed today's Iraqi Turkmans). Some of the larger body stayed there and became the Eastern Turkmans while yet a larger group went to Iran, Armenia-Azerbaijan and finally to Anatolia/Ionia. As you know, the "Byzantine" Greek army was defeated by the Salchukhid/Selchuid sultan Alp Arslan in August 26 1071; after the battle, thousands of Turkmens (still calling themselves as Oghuz, which was abandoned after the 11th-12th centuries) entered Anatolia/Asia Minor and settled there. In the 13th century, a new wave of Turkmens entered Anatolia; this time, these Turkmens were a large group of the Eastern Turkmens fleeing from the Mongol Invasions. Among the second wave of migrations was the Khay tribe which later established the Osmanli or Ottoman Sultanate.
The Khay founded the Ottomans, the Khynykh founded the Salchukhids/Selchuchids, the Afshars founded the Kharamanids and Qachar Dynasty in Iran. All were Oghuz Turks. The modern Turks in Anatolia and Balkans are the general mix of Turkmens who migrated to Asia Minor with Greeks, Armenians, Kurds and Slavs. The Iraqi Turkmens are the smaller group that broke away in Khorasan. The Turkmens in Iran , Khorasan, Afghanistan and Turkmenistan are the Eastern Turkmens. The Muslim Oghuz that settled in Azerbaijan were re-named as Azeris.
The Western Turkmens, Eastern Turkmens and Azerisall are from the Oghuz. The Oghuz are the mixture of Tokhuz Oghuz and other turkish tribes. The Tokhuz Oghuz are one part of the turanian/turkish nation, who descended from the Ding Ling. And those are what we call today Turks. But its well known that those are not the only Turks; There are also the Uyghurs, the Kutrigurs,Oghuz/T.Oghuz, Khazars, Sabars,Avars,Tatars, Mongols, Khouns,Huns, Hunogundur, Oghurs, Khyrghiz, Kharlukhs, Turgish, Pechenegs, Khypchakhs, Kimeks, Kumans and many many other turanian/turkish/mongoloid tribes.

Here is a statue of Kul Tegin born in 685 and died in 731, he was the high commander of Eastern Türük armies, one of the greatest warlord of the turkish tribes and one of the greatest hero's for Turks today. This statue is located in the Museum of Ulaanbaatur, capital of Mongolia. The strong mongol features are presented in his head statue clearly. A typical turanoid mongol.

http://www.byegm.gov.tr/YAYINLARIMIZ/kitaplar/isteturkiye/resimler/106.jpg

[akritas]

lol
I had a debate recently in the net54 forum regarding this issue.
Searching I found this amazing article from a Turk proffessor(not brainwash) Dr. Ahmet TAήAΠIL,TURKISH - MONGOLIAN RELATIONS

.........Turks and Mongolians which placed together on the scene of Central Asian History lived for thousands of years side by side and sometimes together. This togetherness, with otherwords, brotherhood continued sometimes with friendship and sometimes with struggles. The linguistic proximity of this two community is already known. The togetherness in Central Asia that started from the very early stages of the history continued till the past centuries. In the analysis of this togetherness there are two dimensions; political relations and cultural relations. Political relations include relations of war and peace rather, a multidimensional struggle which is a result of sharing the same territory. The cultural relations includes the proximity of maintaning the similar life styles with minimal differences which is the result of living together. Although some differences occured as a result of Turkish communities moved firstly to Western Central Asia and than to the front Asia in the second part of 10th century, relations with Turkish origin communities like “Kipchak”, Kirghiz and “Uyghur” continued for centuries.


............They developed all kind of cultural and political relations. This relation was so close that sometimes Turkish tribes Mongolianised, and sometimes Mongolian tribes Turkisized. As a result of this situation, many times the sources couldn’t decide which tribe is Turkish or Mongolian, they accepted them both Turkish and Mongolian.

[HellenicPride]

Ofcourse Turks are Mongols. I just finished a reading a book Genghis Khan and it this books constantly mentions Turkish tribes that lived in Mongolia. I would be more than happy to post the name of the book author and passages.

[Tsontos]

Turks and Mongols share linguistic and geographic origins but they one people. Mongols enslaved turks for thousands of years

[Attila]

Decide beeing a racist or religionist.

If you tell mongoloids (Turanian people) "Go back to siberia" then you must have something to say about Hungarians ( Magyars ) too .

This reality is well known. Check the "Turanian Map" and "Turanian People" in a Hungarian website below:

w w w.hunmagyar.org/turan/turan.html

They are also speaking an Altaic Language.

Their country is even known in English "The Hun's Land"

And the using frequence of Turanian names such :

-Attila
-Kublai
-Okan
-Mete

are even equal with Turks .



Do you have a plan for them ? Or to be a christian makes them allowed to stay in their geography ?

If you'r beeing racist, tell also Hungarians "Go Siberia back "
If your concern is "religion" then tell Bosnians "Go to Afghanistan"

-In my opinon, both are pretty foolish. I just wanted to share some information with you . Good Luck on your discrimination business.


Kind Regards

[Truth Bearer]

So what's your point Attila you are in denial of yr central asian ancestry?

[Tsontos]

Attila, Turks have nothing do with Huns or Mongols ethnically apart from the fact they belong to the Turkic language family. You Pan-Turkists have similar theories to the who conveniently forgot lingusitic, historical and other anthropolical factors by trying to suggest that all Indo-Europeans were Germanic "Aryans", when in reality all they shared was common lingusitic family.

[Attila]

Truth Bearer, I am proud of my central asian ancestry.Nothing's wrong from beeing from central-asia.Japanese are asians, and Albanians are europeans.

Voulgaroktonos, the website i posted you is not made by a pan-turkist and Turan is even not a theory which was told by a Turk or Mongolian first.

I didnt know our pan-turkists were claiming something about Indo-Europeans and like they are all germans. Thanks for informing me. (I even didnt know they had some works about it - if you share the source, i will be glad reading it)

I simply refuse discussing people who has nothing to be proud except their racial theory. I wont move further in this way of discussion, i have just posted you this for making you a decision between religion or race -which might be conflictive to each other sometime-

i think a probablity which makes you confuse about Turks ; you dont need to analyze their races correctly to hate them. And I met Mongolian people who were very honourable, they are even not aware of problem between Greece-Turkey , so i think they dont deserve such a 'hidden' mass-insult about an issue they have nothing to do with. Because to be mongolian is not a crime , even not an important thing.

As a result, what you need will be given always by some theories and they even dont need be satisfied by science or logic.Much effort about such theories may make you feel more pleased about your final feelings, but therefore it has no different than masturbation .

Your feelings are understandable, and what you feel is what you need. So, you are free to hate Turks, but just know its a neccesity.

As a psychatry law, trying to find the scientific reasons or proofs for your belief or feelings may take you in a foolish position , just beware of this .


Kind Regards.

[Tsontos]

So because one doesnt beleive the pan-turkist crap about the "Turkish nation" being one ethnic unit from Budapest to Ankara to Tokyo means he hates Turks? :lol:

We had a Turk on here posting pictures of Turks from around the world and in them he included a pic of Gennaro Gatuso because some Turkish 'scientist' had found genetic connections between the "Anatolians and the Etruscans". Its just ridiculous

[terastios]

I always thought that's a well known fact!
Turks are Mongols!

[Lakonian]

Truth Bearer, I am proud of my central asian ancestry.Nothing's wrong from beeing from central-asia.Japanese are asians, and Albanians are europeans.

Voulgaroktonos, the website i posted you is not made by a pan-turkist and Turan is even not a theory which was told by a Turk or Mongolian first.

I didnt know our pan-turkists were claiming something about Indo-Europeans and like they are all germans. Thanks for informing me. (I even didnt know they had some works about it - if you share the source, i will be glad reading it)

I simply refuse discussing people who has nothing to be proud except their racial theory. I wont move further in this way of discussion, i have just posted you this for making you a decision between religion or race -which might be conflictive to each other sometime-

i think a probablity which makes you confuse about Turks ; you dont need to analyze their races correctly to hate them. And I met Mongolian people who were very honourable, they are even not aware of problem between Greece-Turkey , so i think they dont deserve such a 'hidden' mass-insult about an issue they have nothing to do with. Because to be mongolian is not a crime , even not an important thing.

As a result, what you need will be given always by some theories and they even dont need be satisfied by science or logic.Much effort about such theories may make you feel more pleased about your final feelings, but therefore it has no different than masturbation .

Your feelings are understandable, and what you feel is what you need. So, you are free to hate Turks, but just know its a neccesity.

As a psychatry law, trying to find the scientific reasons or proofs for your belief or feelings may take you in a foolish position , just beware of this .


Kind Regards.


Well said Atila,

welcome brother of war ( i call all Turks that).

Look, my people, they have justified hate , and unjustified hate. I think one way or another most countried have hate for one another, we all have nationalistic agendas, the politicians do anyway, they play of our emotions.

There is one thing though that should awlays be achieved by all, TRUTH.

Do you recognise that your nation inslaved ours? Or do you feel it placed some sort of democracy? Some sort of new way of life that can be used by all humans? Did you bring new technologies or new ideas or philosophy, way of life? Seriously my frined, i dont think your 400 year presence brought anything to my people but misery.....misery that would create hate for your people that still boils.

Look, people tell me, if you guys where so strong why did Turks crsuh you. I say there wa no us, not a mental or a physical level. We where lost, the only light that shone was our language at that time. So many nation shave passe dthrough us i could loose counbt, but we are here, we know who we are, so doe sthe rest of the wordl.

You need to repsect that, and so does the rest of your nation.

I admit, hey, we got our asses kicked back then, why would i deny this? What i do deny is the fact that Greeks lived greater than than what they did before you came as soem new educational books claim back in Greece.(N not sure what the outcome of that was).

Atila,

i look at your nation with much admiration beacuse of your unification when it comes to you nationality. This is what Greeks have lacked 5000 years back.

I guess, when nations liek your came, we remembered most what it ment to be Hellenic, and we have prooved this more than once.

[Ehetlaios]

Exeis ksefygei teleiws.

Lak, without wanting to insult you, I think you have gone soft on them.

[Lakonian]

Ehetlaios,

im mearly approaching this from a neutral point of view...i dont need to insult anyone to get my point across.

Me?Loose my drive? Come on re, you of all people know me:read:

[Kuniska]

Turks are not Mongols per se. They are a bunch of nomadic tribes and they are mixed with other Balkan, Middle East and North African countries.(former Ottoman empire) The point is they are not one nation. They are plenty. They even have our blood in them...They are united though under the name of Turks and that is how they feel with the exception of the Kurds. Tell me exactly Lakonian why did you post this article here? What was its use?

[Kuniska]

oops Ionian Sword... I meant

[Tsontos]

Turks are not Mongols at all! Mongols ruled over the Turkish tribes and about 700 years before 1453 the Byzantines had an alliance with Turks against Mongols!

[Attila]

Well said Atila,

welcome brother of war ( i call all Turks that).

Look, my people, they have justified hate , and unjustified hate. I think one way or another most countried have hate for one another, we all have nationalistic agendas, the politicians do anyway, they play of our emotions.

There is one thing though that should awlays be achieved by all, TRUTH.

Do you recognise that your nation inslaved ours? Or do you feel it placed some sort of democracy? Some sort of new way of life that can be used by all humans? Did you bring new technologies or new ideas or philosophy, way of life? Seriously my frined, i dont think your 400 year presence brought anything to my people but misery.....misery that would create hate for your people that still boils.

Look, people tell me, if you guys where so strong why did Turks crsuh you. I say there wa no us, not a mental or a physical level. We where lost, the only light that shone was our language at that time. So many nation shave passe dthrough us i could loose counbt, but we are here, we know who we are, so doe sthe rest of the wordl.

You need to repsect that, and so does the rest of your nation.

I admit, hey, we got our asses kicked back then, why would i deny this? What i do deny is the fact that Greeks lived greater than than what they did before you came as soem new educational books claim back in Greece.(N not sure what the outcome of that was).

Atila,

i look at your nation with much admiration beacuse of your unification when it comes to you nationality. This is what Greeks have lacked 5000 years back.

I guess, when nations liek your came, we remembered most what it ment to be Hellenic, and we have prooved this more than once.



1) "Descent" Matter

You and anybody dont need to respect anyone because of nationality. And dont beg people to respect you. If even they do, It has no meaning after you asked them "respect me ".

And do not present yourself like you are "commander of greece" , you are just a citizen who pays taxes and having only political power to vote every election like other milions.

Your all brothers here are "son of alexander" , but nobody here is son of a shoe maker in Athens, nobody is a son of an ancient time prostitute.However the workers and slaves were majority of the society ever. Everyone was not Alexander.(And nationalism even was not a case before 1789). Just like you are today majority of your land - with minimum political power-



2) "Pride" Matter

If my biological brother developed an advanced scientific tool, i would not even be proud of this like "i did" or "we did", cause my brother did , not myself. "Honour" is a personal matter. You cant say you are honorable just because your father is.

And you tell me i will respect "Lakonian" because he is the grand grand grand grand grand grand son ( or he believes he is ) of a nation .

I dont have any idea of honour of your nation, but your personal request here seemed to me pretty much dishonest in human behaviours.



3) "Result"

I will respect you my brother, but not because of your nation, just because you look like you really need it .

Cause it seems, in rest of your life, you will not have any other sort of pride or respect of someone.







Regards

[Lakonian]

????? Look i dont wanna snub this post but its kinda lame. Exactly whats your point? It seems you are trying to psycho analyse me because i ask for respect because i am Greek? Where have i actualy made that evident? It seems you your self carry to much pride

READ.......the request is teh recognition of the Turks inslavement of us, where have i asked for personal respect. Im sorry Atila but your post lacks taste and meaning to what i have pointed out to you brother.

And to be honest, its quite disrespectful of yourself to even question the pride our people carry, and all the people who support our gifts to the world.

And Atila, exactly how many times does your uhm,,,,,civilised nation get recognised to what your contributed to the world?

Oh wait, i do like pide...im joking man, but your right, i shouldnt ask you to respect my ancestors or my nation...you should have that human emotion to do so if you actualy have any remorse, as much as i would look at the Greek Cypriot massacre of the Turks in the south and turks massacre of the Greeks in the North with much disgust!

Your emotional outpour of what you actualy though i was trying to achieve exactly reflects the arrogance most , and i repeat most of your nation shares.

P.S My best man is Turkish, he convirted to Orthodox for me, not to be Greek, this human behaviour and understanding is what separates your people from mine, tolerance for others!


P.P.S Who hear claims to be a direct descendant of Alexander or Leonidas??? But do we deny our culture my friend, and what our ancient forefathers where who WE and by LOGIC many others believe us to be? We have the unbroken language, and the unbroken spirit.

Your nation was conqoured by what we Greeks hated the most, the belief in some sort of devine right to rule over others, and need i repeat what happened to those who tried to push that onto us? You got 400 years of what on us? Nothing man. Now your a dessert who are used for little American run ways and constant empty threats.....your bullies man, and its your people that need a hug.Instead of building with us, beinga brother of war, you still have the brains of sultans.

You wanna question evryones blood line? Who knows,maybe your blood line is of a Kurd?

[Orphic_Hymn]

Your all brothers here are "son of alexander" , but nobody here is son of a shoe maker in Athens, nobody is a son of an ancient time prostitute.However the workers and slaves were majority of the society ever. Everyone was not Alexander.(And nationalism even was not a case before 1789). Just like you are today majority of your land - with minimum political power-

Just two short notes..

1) you correctly note a common characteristic of all people worldwide, which is vanity or conceit if you'd prefer but as I said this is a worldwide phenomenon. How many Turks do you know that claim to be the descendant of a Tellak or some poor bastard who converted cause he couldn't stand the pressure or the Jizya?
I bet everyone you know is the descendant of a glorious Gazi warrior.. right? I hope you see the point.

2) As for nationalism, if you have time, try reading Isocrates' Panegyrikos, cause thats where it all started.

[Attila]

You wanna question evryones blood line? Who knows,maybe your blood line is of a Kurd?

Reminding: I dont question bloods, you are the one who wants to discuss it and i am the one who doesnt recognize and doesnt care it .

I think my post was a lame because i did not accept your virtual-fighting offer you as supporter of greece and i as turkey. You think so, because you did not expect me to not recognize the values you worship. That's the only reason making you angry my friend, if i fought with you in the name of turks you would be very happy ( that's almost all people here hopes - "to be hero of greece by suporting it against a turk" ) but you are still just a citizen and still nothing can do except voting. Sorry, i can not deny logic and truth..

As a person who said things up above, of course to be a kurd would not change anything to me .
If you like to name people , please do name me with the race you think most awful , turk , kurd or gypsy . Just choose one .
And add on the list that all prositutes of the world are my mothers and all homosexuals of the world are my brothers..

so .. Still what i said up above keep its reality.

And maybe you are very proud of the things you believe ( actually to be proud of is the reason of beliefs ) .
But i dont think anyone would be proud of you if even you were a kurd. You are stil not alexander and wont be .


-And someone there asks that how many of Turks are like me.

Just a personal answer ; I have met couple of Turks thinking like me , but i havent met any greece citizen completely thinking like me ( I have been there 3 times - almost totally 1 year-) and many of them were just like you.


i feel shame as a human when i see that some people are motivating themselves to be proud of something created already -with doing nothing else than this - instead of working and trying to create or being one of the creators.

And i dont think you can convince anyone that you are superior , if you dont do anything than beeing proud. You just can masturbate each other.



Your gypsy, kurd, arab, nigger and jew friend Attila




Kind Regards

[Tsontos]

Attila, why is the dominant impression one gets from your posts that you want to beleive everyone is against you and hates Turks?

On various forums I notice this about Turks. They love the saying "A Turk's only friend is a Turk" etc.

Its typical of Turkish nationalism to be exceedingly insecure and paranoid. One only needs to look at MHP's massive support and the political murders today in Turkey.

Even the moderates in Turkey seem to have this kond of overriding paranoia

[akritas_gs]

.your unification when it comes to you nationality. This is what Greeks have lacked 5000 years back..

That is indeed very true.....sadly Lak is very correct there.

[Lakonian]

Reminding: I dont question bloods, you are the one who wants to discuss it and i am the one who doesnt recognize and doesnt care it .

I think my post was a lame because i did not accept your virtual-fighting offer you as supporter of greece and i as turkey. You think so, because you did not expect me to not recognize the values you worship. That's the only reason making you angry my friend, if i fought with you in the name of turks you would be very happy ( that's almost all people here hopes - "to be hero of greece by suporting it against a turk" ) but you are still just a citizen and still nothing can do except voting. Sorry, i can not deny logic and truth..

As a person who said things up above, of course to be a kurd would not change anything to me .
If you like to name people , please do name me with the race you think most awful , turk , kurd or gypsy . Just choose one .
And add on the list that all prositutes of the world are my mothers and all homosexuals of the world are my brothers..

so .. Still what i said up above keep its reality.

And maybe you are very proud of the things you believe ( actually to be proud of is the reason of beliefs ) .
But i dont think anyone would be proud of you if even you were a kurd. You are stil not alexander and wont be .


-And someone there asks that how many of Turks are like me.

Just a personal answer ; I have met couple of Turks thinking like me , but i havent met any greece citizen completely thinking like me ( I have been there 3 times - almost totally 1 year-) and many of them were just like you.


i feel shame as a human when i see that some people are motivating themselves to be proud of something created already -with doing nothing else than this - instead of working and trying to create or being one of the creators.

And i dont think you can convince anyone that you are superior , if you dont do anything than beeing proud. You just can masturbate each other.



Your gypsy, kurd, arab, nigger and jew friend Attila




Kind Regards

oh my neighbour,

you have deep issues. You wanna be a victim go ahead, but try not to contradict yourself by saying all Greeks are like me and we only carry pride of what we did and cannot do now. And making empty insults such as me never being an Alexander, why would i even try, no one can ever be him again, this is logic.

I still dont follow your negative view on Greeks and there ancestral pride??? And why do you consider being a Kurd a bad thing? I only played the same dice you did.

And why did you use the word Nigger? Atila, you see, now you revealing the inner you.

My friend your only being yourself, and the difference is, i dont judge you because of it. Thats just the way you people are.

I agree with only one view of yours, that of us, not trying to do more than our ancestors did, i agree with you there.

But then again, i dont see how your nation would respect us rising to be who we where and more....infact, i think you guys would cry....im not making fun.

By the way, doesnt it seem normal for a human to marvel and take pride of who they where and what they did and that they could never do something likethat again??? Like your Alexander the Great example:huh:

Is that not why a human takes pride? Or are you annoyed like most others when a Greek opens his big fat mouth to once again point out that " HEY, WE CREATED THAT TOO!":laugh:

[Attila]

oh my neighbour,

you have deep issues. You wanna be a victim go ahead, but try not to contradict yourself by saying all Greeks are like me and we only carry pride of what we did and cannot do now. And making empty insults such as me never being an Alexander, why would i even try, no one can ever be him again, this is logic.

I still dont follow your negative view on Greeks and there ancestral pride??? And why do you consider being a Kurd a bad thing? I only played the same dice you did.

And why did you use the word Nigger? Atila, you see, now you revealing the inner you.

My friend your only being yourself, and the difference is, i dont judge you because of it. Thats just the way you people are.

I agree with only one view of yours, that of us, not trying to do more than our ancestors did, i agree with you there.

But then again, i dont see how your nation would respect us rising to be who we where and more....infact, i think you guys would cry....im not making fun.

By the way, doesnt it seem normal for a human to marvel and take pride of who they where and what they did and that they could never do something likethat again??? Like your Alexander the Great example:huh:

Is that not why a human takes pride? Or are you annoyed like most others when a Greek opens his big fat mouth to once again point out that " HEY, WE CREATED THAT TOO!":laugh:



I am not the one here who can teach how to read an article to a person who is over 14 years old.

I am repeating; you are not aristo , pythagoras or demokles . And i am not Ataturk or genghis Khan .

You are closer socialogically to poor old greece citizen man begging on the streets and the greece citizen thief who stole my beg.

Sorry but i dont think you would be a scientist if even you lived in ancient greece.

I dont think any inteligent person would care your screams that you are their blood, and i dont think anyone will pay you money. Do they ?

Dont you still go to your jobs to sacrifice your all labor force ? Does any company pays greece citizens more than others ?

-I have been in greece for job-What do you recomend to my greek workers ?
Are you sure you'r not eager to be one of them if i pay you good money ?

dont fool yourself. This life is real, not your ghosts.

I am just warning you for your sake, such masturbations may worth your whole life , and when your grand grand grand sons die even after 4000 years ,
they will still be proud of ghosts and will be still ordinary citizens.

I tell it to my people too
And you too ,

be realistic then everyone will admire you , nobody admires each other because of the id they carry.



Take care , less masturbation more thinking and reading.

[Lakonian]

I dont see why its wrong to take pride of what we gave to the world , and how famous people admire us more than we do ourselves.Alas we have covered this.You seem to be disturbed by how much pride we have and how much attention we recieve by all aspects of life.

Oh Attila,

here i was thinking we where having a civilised conversation, once again, the inability to face truth has made you reveal your hate.

Nothing but insults.

Our conversation ends here.

Take care.

[Euklid]

Attila, back from vacation?

How was it in Bodrum?

[SEVIL]

You're Insulting Me For My Ancestory,origin Being Euroasian;coming From The Huns Of The Turanian Land, Being Mongol Etc. However,your Insult Won't Change My Views. I'm Sure You're Proud Of Your Origins, So Am I. I'm A Turk! Eventhough Greeks And Turks Different Origins,we Share The Same Culture; We Listen The Same Music(maybe You In Greek And I In Turkish),dance The Same Way,eat The Same Food Etc. I Dont' Know If I Have Any Greek In My Blood But There Is A Big Possibility. I Can't Hate Greeks As My Hatered Would Only Destroy Myself, Won't Help Turks. I Would Like To Tell You That I Have Greek Friends From Greece Whome First See Me As A Human Being Than As A Turk, Have Greek Friends In Turkey Whome I Sometime Feel Sorry As They're Treated Unfairly By Turks Similar To You. Yes,we Attacked Your Homeland In The Past But So Did You;to Turks Or Other People. Everyone Has Right To Defend Their Own Country. However,you Can Relax As That Was In The Past,we Don't Have Any Plans Of Taking Greece From You. Past Is Past. Forget The Past And Look At The Future In A Positive Way.in Short,you're Wasting Your Time Here As You Won't Achieve Anything By Insulting Turks' Origins But Destroy Yourself. I Would Suggest That You Spend Your Time For Better Things Like Jogging,reading,studying,helping Greeks Or Other Nations In Need Etc. And Start Enjoying Yourself.

[SEVIL]

Voulgaroktonos, PLEASE DON'T TELL ME MY ORIGINS ARE NOT THE HUNS. I STILL REMEMBER THE PICTURES OF THE HUNS ON THE WALLS OF MY PRIMARY SCHOOL CLASS. WE HAD TO LEARN ALL NAMES OF THE HUNS FROM OGUZ HUN TO ATILLA HUN. I DON'T KNOW WHERE YOU COME FROM AS I DON'T HAVE TIME TO READ ALL THE POSTS HERE BUT DON'T TELL AND TEACH ME MY OWN HISTORY. TURKS KNOW THEIR HISTORY VERY WELL. YOU GO AND LEARN YOUR OWN HISTORY WHICH I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR.

[SEVIL]

By The Way I Don't Know How I Ended Up Here As I Was Just Looking For My Friend On The Net. His Surname Is "turan" :)

[Orphic_Hymn]

Voulgaroktonos, PLEASE DON'T TELL ME MY ORIGINS ARE NOT THE HUNS. I STILL REMEMBER THE PICTURES OF THE HUNS ON THE WALLS OF MY PRIMARY SCHOOL CLASS. WE HAD TO LEARN ALL NAMES OF THE HUNS FROM OGUZ HUN TO ATILLA HUN. I DON'T KNOW WHERE YOU COME FROM AS I DON'T HAVE TIME TO READ ALL THE POSTS HERE BUT DON'T TELL AND TEACH ME MY OWN HISTORY. TURKS KNOW THEIR HISTORY VERY WELL. YOU GO AND LEARN YOUR OWN HISTORY WHICH I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR.

Don't worry Sevil, we all know what you're taught in school, the problem is that young Turks like yourself prefer using the internet for anything but obtaining the knowledge they've intentionally deprived you of.

So you were taught to claim the Huns.. Interesting, especially since science proves the exact opposite.


"The gene of Turks, who moved to Anatolia from Central Asia along with Seljuks, was not widely spread in this region", officer of National Geographic Spencer Wells considers.

This statement was not a surprise for Turkish scholars, as most of them have a similar point of view, reported the Yerkir newspaper. Professor of Faculty of Molecular Biology and Genetics of Istanbul Bogazici University Aslihan Tolun reported that research heald 5-6 years ago along with foreign scholars showed Turks were «multi-elemental».

In Tolun's words, «in genetic respect Turks are very much like the Balkan peoples, Caucasians, Armenians and Arabs, however they have peculiarities.»
«We never stayed at the same place and easily became close with local populations, preserving our language and our culture. Thus, it is natural there is not Turkish gene in pure form,» said professor of Medical University of Ankara Khakan Shataroghlu."

The most interesting part of this study, is that Spencer Wells, Aslihan Tolun and Khakan Shataroghlu all agree that the oldest link may be the SELJUKS nothing "older" NOT even Goturks.

Here's the same reproduced from you own Milliyet (http://www.milliyet.com.tr/2005/05/17/guncel/agun.html)

It is scientific reality like this that has made your government's propaganda machine turn towards official claims on autochthonous populations of Anatolia and Hellenic history.


In the future do try not to post in caps...

[Orphic_Hymn]

Since I'm at it, a bit more info on the alleged relationship of today's Turks to their ancestral homeland.


Genetic affinities among Mongol ethnic groups and their relationship to Turks (http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/doi/abs/10.1034/j.1399-0039.2003.00043.x)


Abstract:The central Asian country Mongolia is home to more than 20 tribes and ethnic groups, some of which are related to neighboring Turkic populations. The main Mongolian people, Khalkha, live in central and eastern Mongolia while the Tsaatan minority lives in the north of the country. The Oold minority is from the western Altai mountain region and live in close proximity with Turkic people. We have typed the HLA-A, -B, -Cw, -DRB1 and -DQB1 loci by PCR-SSP in these three Mongolian populations as well as a sample of the German population. To examine their genetic relationships, a sample of the Turkish population already typed at the HLA-A, -B and -DRB1 loci were used. Altogether five populations were analyzed: Khalkha (n = 100), Tsaatan (n = 72), Oold (n = 52), German (n = 260) and (Anatolian) Turkish (n = 498). Nei's unbiased genetic identity (GI) and genetic distance (GD) were estimated from genotypes using PopGene v1.31, and dendrograms were constructed using phylip. The results suggested a close relationship of the Khalkha to the Tsaatan. The Turks and Germans were equally distant to all three Mongolian populations. These results confirmed the lack of strong genetic relationship between the Mongols and the Turks despite the close relationship of their languages (Altaic group) and shared historical neighborhood. This study has provided useful population data for genetic and anthropologic studies bridging eastern and western populations.

It becomes obvious from the above that we may safely conclude that those that decided to put an end to the use of the rediculous term "Ural-Altaic race" were correct since it represents a language and culture, NOT an actual race and furthermore, that the majority of the population of modern day Turkey is actually the product of forcive assimilations (see jannisarry) and willful conversions of the Hellenic, Assyrian and even Armenian populations to Islam.

Its obvious that some propaganda machines do work wonders.